E446 Navigating the Bible: Daniel

Shadrach, Meek, and Abedneo replied, "Oh Shadrach, Meek, and Abedneo replied, "Oh Nebuchadnezzar, we do not need to defend Nebuchadnezzar, we do not need to defend Nebuchadnezzar, we do not need to defend ourselves before you. If we are thrown ourselves before you. If we are thrown ourselves before you. If we are thrown into the blazing furnace, the God whom into the blazing furnace, the God whom into the blazing furnace, the God whom we serve is able to save us. He will we serve is able to save us. He will we serve is able to save us. He will rescue us from your power, your majesty. rescue us from your power, your majesty. rescue us from your power, your majesty. But even if he doesn't, we want to make But even if he doesn't, we want to make But even if he doesn't, we want to make it clear to you, your majesty, that we it clear to you, your majesty, that we it clear to you, your majesty, that we will never serve your gods or worship will never serve your gods or worship will never serve your gods or worship the gold statue you have set up. the gold statue you have set up. the gold statue you have set up. Daniel 3 16 to 18. Daniel 3 16 to 18. Daniel 3 16 to 18. The book of Daniel is perhaps the most The book of Daniel is perhaps the most The book of Daniel is perhaps the most well-known of the major prophets, but well-known of the major prophets, but well-known of the major prophets, but also perhaps the least understood. also perhaps the least understood. also perhaps the least understood. It is a book of variation. There are It is a book of variation. There are It is a book of variation. There are perfectly understandable and well-known perfectly understandable and well-known perfectly understandable and well-known stories, stories, stories, but there are also visions and dreams but there are also visions and dreams but there are also visions and dreams and angels and hands writing on walls. and angels and hands writing on walls. and angels and hands writing on walls. There is some truly crazy stuff in the There is some truly crazy stuff in the There is some truly crazy stuff in the book of Daniel. At its heart, Daniel is book of Daniel. At its heart, Daniel is book of Daniel. At its heart, Daniel is a book about the kingdom of God, about a book about the kingdom of God, about a book about the kingdom of God, about the faithfulness of God, and about the the faithfulness of God, and about the the faithfulness of God, and about the providence of God. To help us navigate providence of God. To help us navigate providence of God. To help us navigate the book of Daniel is Dr. John the the book of Daniel is Dr. John the the book of Daniel is Dr. John the Golden Gay, Golden Gay, Golden Gay, senior professor of Old Testament and senior professor of Old Testament and senior professor of Old Testament and the David Allen Hubard Professor the David Allen Hubard Professor the David Allen Hubard Professor Ammeritis at Fuller Theological Seminary

Ammeritis at Fuller Theological Seminary Ammeritis at Fuller Theological Seminary and author of many books about the Old and author of many books about the Old and author of many books about the Old Testament, including a commentary on the Testament, including a commentary on the Testament, including a commentary on the book of Daniel. My name is Jason Wheelen book of Daniel. My name is Jason Wheelen book of Daniel. My name is Jason Wheelen and this is doable disciplehip. and this is doable disciplehip. and this is doable disciplehip. Navigating the Bible Daniel. Navigating the Bible Daniel. Navigating the Bible Daniel. [Music] All right, Dr. John Golden Gate, thank All right, Dr. John Golden Gate, thank you so much for joining me today as we you so much for joining me today as we you so much for joining me today as we dive into Daniel. As I was saying a dive into Daniel. As I was saying a dive into Daniel. As I was saying a little bit before we started recording, little bit before we started recording, little bit before we started recording, I think it's a book that a lot of people I think it's a book that a lot of people I think it's a book that a lot of people think that they know probably well. think that they know probably well. think that they know probably well. they've heard the, you know, some they've heard the, you know, some they've heard the, you know, some stories about Daniel and they're like, stories about Daniel and they're like, stories about Daniel and they're like, "Oh, yeah, Daniel, I know it." Um, but I "Oh, yeah, Daniel, I know it." Um, but I "Oh, yeah, Daniel, I know it." Um, but I think when they actually dive into it think when they actually dive into it think when they actually dive into it and read it, they might go, "Whoa, what and read it, they might go, "Whoa, what and read it, they might go, "Whoa, what is happening in this book?" So, I'm is happening in this book?" So, I'm is happening in this book?" So, I'm excited to have you help us to navigate excited to have you help us to navigate excited to have you help us to navigate through this book today. through this book today. through this book today. >> Okay, >> Okay, >> Okay, >> it's going to be great. Um, so with all >> it's going to be great. Um, so with all >> it's going to be great. Um, so with all these books, let's start with the basic these books, let's start with the basic these books, let's start with the basic details. So, do we know who wrote the details. So, do we know who wrote the details. So, do we know who wrote the book of Daniel and maybe when it was book of Daniel and maybe when it was book of Daniel and maybe when it was written? And then I always like to frame written? And then I always like to frame written? And then I always like to frame it. How does knowing these or maybe not it. How does knowing these or maybe not it. How does knowing these or maybe not knowing these things affect how we read knowing these things affect how we read knowing these things affect how we read the book?

the book? the book? >> Well, fortunately, as is the case with >> Well, fortunately, as is the case with >> Well, fortunately, as is the case with lots of the scriptures, we don't know lots of the scriptures, we don't know lots of the scriptures, we don't know who wrote them. who wrote them. who wrote them. >> Um, but what's actually more important, >> Um, but what's actually more important, >> Um, but what's actually more important, and I mean, God apparently didn't think and I mean, God apparently didn't think and I mean, God apparently didn't think it was essential for us to know that in it was essential for us to know that in it was essential for us to know that in order to understand it. order to understand it. order to understand it. >> True. Um but uh uh but what what we do >> True. Um but uh uh but what what we do >> True. Um but uh uh but what what we do know um at least I think we know um when know um at least I think we know um when know um at least I think we know um when it was written and who it was written it was written and who it was written it was written and who it was written for. Uh and that's actually much more for. Uh and that's actually much more for. Uh and that's actually much more important. It's much more valuable that important. It's much more valuable that important. It's much more valuable that we know who God was seeking to speak to we know who God was seeking to speak to we know who God was seeking to speak to through this book. Never mind about who through this book. Never mind about who through this book. Never mind about who he was speaking through, if you see what he was speaking through, if you see what he was speaking through, if you see what I mean. I mean. I mean. >> With Daniel, it's kind of it's >> With Daniel, it's kind of it's >> With Daniel, it's kind of it's interesting particularly because there interesting particularly because there interesting particularly because there are two answers, both of which are are two answers, both of which are are two answers, both of which are right. It's it's a book. We'll probably right. It's it's a book. We'll probably right. It's it's a book. We'll probably find ourselves talking about this again. find ourselves talking about this again. find ourselves talking about this again. It's a book of two halves. It's a book of two halves. It's a book of two halves. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Uh the first half uh is a collection of >> Uh the first half uh is a collection of >> Uh the first half uh is a collection of stories about Daniel and his friends who stories about Daniel and his friends who stories about Daniel and his friends who have been taken off um in forced have been taken off um in forced have been taken off um in forced migration to Babylon and who are needing migration to Babylon and who are needing migration to Babylon and who are needing to face the issues that arise there to face the issues that arise there to face the issues that arise there which are sometimes opportunities but which are sometimes opportunities but which are sometimes opportunities but quite often um uh temptations and trials quite often um uh temptations and trials quite often um uh temptations and trials and problems. Uh and so the book the and problems. Uh and so the book the and problems. Uh and so the book the stories speak to people sometime in the stories speak to people sometime in the stories speak to people sometime in the sixth fifth century something like that sixth fifth century something like that sixth fifth century something like that who are themselves living um in exile or who are themselves living um in exile or who are themselves living um in exile or in dispersion away from home and deals in dispersion away from home and deals in dispersion away from home and deals with issues that would arise for them.

with issues that would arise for them. with issues that would arise for them. One of the things that happens there One of the things that happens there One of the things that happens there though is that Daniel gets a vision um though is that Daniel gets a vision um though is that Daniel gets a vision um about the empires that control their about the empires that control their about the empires that control their lives. And in the second half of the lives. And in the second half of the lives. And in the second half of the book, what you then get is a series of book, what you then get is a series of book, what you then get is a series of kind of subvisions really that are kind of subvisions really that are kind of subvisions really that are expositions of that first vision and expositions of that first vision and expositions of that first vision and that I think are kind of inspired by it that I think are kind of inspired by it that I think are kind of inspired by it somehow. And when you look at who those somehow. And when you look at who those somehow. And when you look at who those visions speak to, it's people who are visions speak to, it's people who are visions speak to, it's people who are back in Jerusalem uh several centuries back in Jerusalem uh several centuries back in Jerusalem uh several centuries later where they are also under later where they are also under later where they are also under pressure. pressure. pressure. They're under pressure from the uh not They're under pressure from the uh not They're under pressure from the uh not the Babylonian Empire and not the the Babylonian Empire and not the the Babylonian Empire and not the Persian Empire, but the Greek Persian Empire, but the Greek Persian Empire, but the Greek Hellenistic Syrian Empire in about the Hellenistic Syrian Empire in about the Hellenistic Syrian Empire in about the second century where the emperor uh is second century where the emperor uh is second century where the emperor uh is trying to stop them worshiping the Lord trying to stop them worshiping the Lord trying to stop them worshiping the Lord in accordance with what the Torah says. in accordance with what the Torah says. in accordance with what the Torah says. >> And some of them are obeying and some of >> And some of them are obeying and some of >> And some of them are obeying and some of them aren't and are getting persecuted them aren't and are getting persecuted them aren't and are getting persecuted and even martyed for it. And so what and even martyed for it. And so what and even martyed for it. And so what these visions are doing is promising these visions are doing is promising these visions are doing is promising them is kind of reassuring them that them is kind of reassuring them that them is kind of reassuring them that God's at l at at work in all this and is God's at l at at work in all this and is God's at l at at work in all this and is lord over it. Uh and promising them that lord over it. Uh and promising them that lord over it. Uh and promising them that he's going to um bring about the he's going to um bring about the he's going to um bring about the fulfillment of his purpose and that they fulfillment of his purpose and that they fulfillment of his purpose and that they can therefore carry on trusting him. So can therefore carry on trusting him. So can therefore carry on trusting him. So it's two different sort of audiences um it's two different sort of audiences um it's two different sort of audiences um which have got overlaps but are a bit which have got overlaps but are a bit which have got overlaps but are a bit different in um where they are.

different in um where they are. different in um where they are. >> Yeah. I think as you as you mentioned, >> Yeah. I think as you as you mentioned, >> Yeah. I think as you as you mentioned, it's helpful to to remember for the it's helpful to to remember for the it's helpful to to remember for the listener or the reader that this is, you listener or the reader that this is, you listener or the reader that this is, you know, as they're talking about how know, as they're talking about how know, as they're talking about how Daniel and his friends were into forced Daniel and his friends were into forced Daniel and his friends were into forced exile in to Babylonian captivity, right? exile in to Babylonian captivity, right? exile in to Babylonian captivity, right? So, we're going it's it's important to So, we're going it's it's important to So, we're going it's it's important to keep in mind because as as you read in keep in mind because as as you read in keep in mind because as as you read in the Bible, not everything is happening the Bible, not everything is happening the Bible, not everything is happening chronologically. So you could So like chronologically. So you could So like chronologically. So you could So like we've already done episodes on Ezra and we've already done episodes on Ezra and we've already done episodes on Ezra and Nehemiah where we're talking about going Nehemiah where we're talking about going Nehemiah where we're talking about going back to Jerusalem and it's like oh well back to Jerusalem and it's like oh well back to Jerusalem and it's like oh well wait so so but then we're entering into wait so so but then we're entering into wait so so but then we're entering into these prophets and uh they haven't even these prophets and uh they haven't even these prophets and uh they haven't even left yet. Jerusalem hasn't fallen yet. left yet. Jerusalem hasn't fallen yet. left yet. Jerusalem hasn't fallen yet. You know there these warnings and then You know there these warnings and then You know there these warnings and then you get lamentations which is oh it it you get lamentations which is oh it it you get lamentations which is oh it it did fall. And then you get Daniel which did fall. And then you get Daniel which did fall. And then you get Daniel which is okay we're going back into captivity is okay we're going back into captivity is okay we're going back into captivity here a little bit. So, it kind of jumps here a little bit. So, it kind of jumps here a little bit. So, it kind of jumps around and the um if you're looking at around and the um if you're looking at around and the um if you're looking at it from a straight it from a straight it from a straight chronology point of view. I just think chronology point of view. I just think chronology point of view. I just think that's helpful to remember that's helpful to remember that's helpful to remember >> Daniel is is kind of just after >> Daniel is is kind of just after >> Daniel is is kind of just after Lamentations.

Lamentations. Lamentations. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> And just before the beginning of of the >> And just before the beginning of of the >> And just before the beginning of of the book of Ezra book of Ezra book of Ezra >> uh but the visions are way later after >> uh but the visions are way later after >> uh but the visions are way later after the Ezra Nemiah time. the Ezra Nemiah time. the Ezra Nemiah time. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> That's just to make it more complicated. >> That's just to make it more complicated. >> That's just to make it more complicated. Thank you very much, John. Thank you very much, John. Thank you very much, John. important to keep in mind. It's been important to keep in mind. It's been important to keep in mind. It's been it's fun to talk about this book right it's fun to talk about this book right it's fun to talk about this book right after we did Ezekiel because they're after we did Ezekiel because they're after we did Ezekiel because they're both books that are very interesting but both books that are very interesting but both books that are very interesting but get into some really interesting stuff. get into some really interesting stuff. get into some really interesting stuff. So, it it's like it's like we took a So, it it's like it's like we took a So, it it's like it's like we took a little bit of a turn after after um little bit of a turn after after um little bit of a turn after after um Isaiah and Jeremiah and then we're going Isaiah and Jeremiah and then we're going Isaiah and Jeremiah and then we're going to get into some more um ethereal like to get into some more um ethereal like to get into some more um ethereal like you know stuff with visions and whatnot you know stuff with visions and whatnot you know stuff with visions and whatnot with Ezekiel and Daniel which is a lot with Ezekiel and Daniel which is a lot with Ezekiel and Daniel which is a lot of fun. So, how would you describe the of fun. So, how would you describe the of fun. So, how would you describe the book of Daniel in one sentence? book of Daniel in one sentence? book of Daniel in one sentence? >> Um, the one of the most um interesting >> Um, the one of the most um interesting >> Um, the one of the most um interesting things I ever heard anybody say or things I ever heard anybody say or things I ever heard anybody say or rather write about Daniel was this that rather write about Daniel was this that rather write about Daniel was this that Daniel is the great book in scripture Daniel is the great book in scripture Daniel is the great book in scripture about the kingdom of God.

about the kingdom of God. about the kingdom of God. And this guy then said, "People think And this guy then said, "People think And this guy then said, "People think that that if you want to understand the that that if you want to understand the that that if you want to understand the kingdom of God, you simply uh look at kingdom of God, you simply uh look at kingdom of God, you simply uh look at what Jesus says." what Jesus says." what Jesus says." >> Sure. But you don't really get that get >> Sure. But you don't really get that get >> Sure. But you don't really get that get that unless you go behind uh to Daniel that unless you go behind uh to Daniel that unless you go behind uh to Daniel because Daniel talks so much about the because Daniel talks so much about the because Daniel talks so much about the kingdom of God. It's about God's um will kingdom of God. It's about God's um will kingdom of God. It's about God's um will being being brought about in the world being being brought about in the world being being brought about in the world about God's kingship becoming a reality about God's kingship becoming a reality about God's kingship becoming a reality in the world. in the world. in the world. >> And uh that's my one thing. >> And uh that's my one thing. >> And uh that's my one thing. >> No, I like that so much. That's an >> No, I like that so much. That's an >> No, I like that so much. That's an interesting lens to read the book interesting lens to read the book interesting lens to read the book through. If you begin reading through through. If you begin reading through through. If you begin reading through the book of Daniel with that lens, the book of Daniel with that lens, the book of Daniel with that lens, >> Yeah. I think you're going to see it >> Yeah. I think you're going to see it >> Yeah. I think you're going to see it everywhere. It's this it's a whole book everywhere. It's this it's a whole book everywhere. It's this it's a whole book about God's economy in a different way about God's economy in a different way about God's economy in a different way which um I think yeah that's a which um I think yeah that's a which um I think yeah that's a fascinating lens and I'm sure that that fascinating lens and I'm sure that that fascinating lens and I'm sure that that that lens is going to color the rest of that lens is going to color the rest of that lens is going to color the rest of our conversation. So so keep that in our conversation. So so keep that in our conversation. So so keep that in mind listener. mind listener. mind listener. >> It probably will. Yeah. >> It probably will. Yeah. >> It probably will. Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. It's a the great book about >> Yeah. Yeah. It's a the great book about >> Yeah. Yeah. It's a the great book about the kingdom of God. So okay. So then the kingdom of God. So okay. So then the kingdom of God. So okay. So then let's talk about the let's talk about the let's talk about the we usually we talk about the narrative we usually we talk about the narrative we usually we talk about the narrative flow of the book and this book has a flow of the book and this book has a flow of the book and this book has a little bit of a narrative flow at the little bit of a narrative flow at the little bit of a narrative flow at the beginning but as you said it's a book of beginning but as you said it's a book of beginning but as you said it's a book of two books or two halves and then we get two books or two halves and then we get two books or two halves and then we get into something different. So can you into something different. So can you into something different. So can you describe the describe the describe the trajectory of this book? Where does this trajectory of this book? Where does this trajectory of this book? Where does this book take us?

book take us? book take us? Well, it it starts off with these guys Well, it it starts off with these guys Well, it it starts off with these guys um in uh this experience of forced um in uh this experience of forced um in uh this experience of forced migration and describes various things migration and describes various things migration and describes various things that happened to them. Uh and then it that happened to them. Uh and then it that happened to them. Uh and then it goes to these visions that are more that goes to these visions that are more that goes to these visions that are more that more relate to the way that to what was more relate to the way that to what was more relate to the way that to what was happening several centuries later. So it happening several centuries later. So it happening several centuries later. So it is an arc but arc is a very good word is an arc but arc is a very good word is an arc but arc is a very good word >> better a better word than flow. Did you >> better a better word than flow. Did you >> better a better word than flow. Did you use the word flow? So, so flow is how we use the word flow? So, so flow is how we use the word flow? So, so flow is how we kind of talked about earlier, but arc is kind of talked about earlier, but arc is kind of talked about earlier, but arc is great. great. great. >> It goes like that. You see, it goes from >> It goes like that. You see, it goes from >> It goes like that. You see, it goes from the exile to the second century with a the exile to the second century with a the exile to the second century with a kind of jump. kind of jump. kind of jump. >> Well, it does go in between. It does it >> Well, it does go in between. It does it >> Well, it does go in between. It does it does uh the the visions do take you from does uh the the visions do take you from does uh the the visions do take you from one to the other, but it's got the the one to the other, but it's got the the one to the other, but it's got the the the two ends are very important. the two ends are very important. the two ends are very important. >> So, for that first half of the book that >> So, for that first half of the book that >> So, for that first half of the book that is following along the story, can you is following along the story, can you is following along the story, can you give our listeners the highlights of the give our listeners the highlights of the give our listeners the highlights of the story of Daniel and his friends? story of Daniel and his friends? story of Daniel and his friends? Uh well they get they get taken off into Uh well they get they get taken off into Uh well they get they get taken off into exile with loads of other people uh exile with loads of other people uh exile with loads of other people uh after the in the in connection with the after the in the in connection with the after the in the in connection with the fall of Jerusalem in 587.

fall of Jerusalem in 587. fall of Jerusalem in 587. Uh they are amongst the uh most of the Uh they are amongst the uh most of the Uh they are amongst the uh most of the people many of the people who were taken people many of the people who were taken people many of the people who were taken off into exile were the people whom the off into exile were the people whom the off into exile were the people whom the Babylonians thought it was worthwhile to Babylonians thought it was worthwhile to Babylonians thought it was worthwhile to take into exile the people who would be take into exile the people who would be take into exile the people who would be useful. useful. useful. >> Yeah. So these are guys who are college >> Yeah. So these are guys who are college >> Yeah. So these are guys who are college age who are then sent off to college in age who are then sent off to college in age who are then sent off to college in Babylon in order to be able to um get Babylon in order to be able to um get Babylon in order to be able to um get themselves equipped uh for working in themselves equipped uh for working in themselves equipped uh for working in the Babylonian administration. Uh and the Babylonian administration. Uh and the Babylonian administration. Uh and the stories are then about the um the stories are then about the um the stories are then about the um problems and the challenges and the problems and the challenges and the problems and the challenges and the difficulties of being involved in the difficulties of being involved in the difficulties of being involved in the Babylonian administration. Babylonian administration. Babylonian administration. um the ways in which they are put under um the ways in which they are put under um the ways in which they are put under pressure but also the ways in which pressure but also the ways in which pressure but also the ways in which they're able to prove that the kind of they're able to prove that the kind of they're able to prove that the kind of education that they get from the Lord is education that they get from the Lord is education that they get from the Lord is actually more useful than the kind of actually more useful than the kind of actually more useful than the kind of education they got from college. education they got from college. education they got from college. >> That's the first half. >> That's the first half. >> That's the first half. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> What did you ask me? Did you >> What did you ask me? Did you >> What did you ask me? Did you >> you want that's what you asked me? Yeah. >> you want that's what you asked me? Yeah. >> you want that's what you asked me? Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Those main points, right? Because >> Yeah. Those main points, right? Because >> Yeah. Those main points, right? Because I I think pe a lot of people would think I I think pe a lot of people would think I I think pe a lot of people would think of the book of Daniel and they probably of the book of Daniel and they probably of the book of Daniel and they probably think of okay that's the book that has think of okay that's the book that has think of okay that's the book that has the fiery furnace and that's the book the fiery furnace and that's the book the fiery furnace and that's the book that that has that that has that that has >> Daniel in the lion's den and and what >> Daniel in the lion's den and and what >> Daniel in the lion's den and and what >> well those are two of the uh when I >> well those are two of the uh when I >> well those are two of the uh when I talked about being being put under talked about being being put under talked about being being put under pressure being threatened with a fiery pressure being threatened with a fiery pressure being threatened with a fiery furnace and putting in the lens that's furnace and putting in the lens that's furnace and putting in the lens that's what I call pressure.

what I call pressure. what I call pressure. >> Yeah. Yeah. That that is a a clear >> Yeah. Yeah. That that is a a clear >> Yeah. Yeah. That that is a a clear pressure point. And again, and there's a pressure point. And again, and there's a pressure point. And again, and there's a reason that those stories are so reason that those stories are so reason that those stories are so commonly told in like a kid's Bible commonly told in like a kid's Bible commonly told in like a kid's Bible school. Is there great stories school. Is there great stories school. Is there great stories to, as you said, to talk about what it to, as you said, to talk about what it to, as you said, to talk about what it means to stand up for your faith, to means to stand up for your faith, to means to stand up for your faith, to have a strong faith, strong convictions have a strong faith, strong convictions have a strong faith, strong convictions about your belief in God in the midst of about your belief in God in the midst of about your belief in God in the midst of >> even more about the fact that God is >> even more about the fact that God is >> even more about the fact that God is faithful. The Bible is not about us. faithful. The Bible is not about us. faithful. The Bible is not about us. It's about God. It's about God. It's about God. >> Yes. Yes. 100%. It's a great picture of >> Yes. Yes. 100%. It's a great picture of >> Yes. Yes. 100%. It's a great picture of God. The three friends in Daniel have to God. The three friends in Daniel have to God. The three friends in Daniel have to be faithful, but they are faith. But but be faithful, but they are faith. But but be faithful, but they are faith. But but the other side of their being faithful the other side of their being faithful the other side of their being faithful is God being faithful is God being faithful is God being faithful >> 100%. And and and and that's an >> 100%. And and and and that's an >> 100%. And and and and that's an incredibly important story, especially incredibly important story, especially incredibly important story, especially if you look at the context of exile is if you look at the context of exile is if you look at the context of exile is these stories of God's continued these stories of God's continued these stories of God's continued faithfulness even in a foreign land. faithfulness even in a foreign land. faithfulness even in a foreign land. Even even though he let Jerusalem fall, Even even though he let Jerusalem fall, Even even though he let Jerusalem fall, >> he's his faithfulness still continued. >> he's his faithfulness still continued. >> he's his faithfulness still continued. So for those people who were So for those people who were So for those people who were not only there at the time in Babylon, not only there at the time in Babylon, not only there at the time in Babylon, but also the people who this book was but also the people who this book was but also the people who this book was being written to and for having these being written to and for having these being written to and for having these continued reminders of God's continued reminders of God's continued reminders of God's faithfulness because boy did they and us faithfulness because boy did they and us faithfulness because boy did they and us still today need continued reminders of still today need continued reminders of still today need continued reminders of God's faithfulness to keep us on track.

God's faithfulness to keep us on track. God's faithfulness to keep us on track. Those stories are they just ring with Those stories are they just ring with Those stories are they just ring with such importance and in a way that we can such importance and in a way that we can such importance and in a way that we can understand but is even more powerful for understand but is even more powerful for understand but is even more powerful for them at the time. them at the time. them at the time. Right. Right. Right. >> And then so for the second half of the >> And then so for the second half of the >> And then so for the second half of the book with the visions, what is the onset book with the visions, what is the onset book with the visions, what is the onset of of Daniel's visions? What is the of of Daniel's visions? What is the of of Daniel's visions? What is the onset of what God is doing through that onset of what God is doing through that onset of what God is doing through that part of the book? part of the book? part of the book? >> By the onset, you mean the situation >> By the onset, you mean the situation >> By the onset, you mean the situation that they speak to? that they speak to? that they speak to? >> Yeah. Sure. Yes. >> Yeah. Sure. Yes. >> Yeah. Sure. Yes. >> Yeah. So, so in the second century, uh, >> Yeah. So, so in the second century, uh, >> Yeah. So, so in the second century, uh, so, uh, this is after Ezra and Nehemiah. so, uh, this is after Ezra and Nehemiah. so, uh, this is after Ezra and Nehemiah. So people have been free to go back to So people have been free to go back to So people have been free to go back to Jerusalem. Uh and the there's been a Jerusalem. Uh and the there's been a Jerusalem. Uh and the there's been a community in Jerusalem for several community in Jerusalem for several community in Jerusalem for several centuries. It's it's it's still um not centuries. It's it's it's still um not centuries. It's it's it's still um not um as impressive as it would have been um as impressive as it would have been um as impressive as it would have been 500 years previously. Uh and it's still 500 years previously. Uh and it's still 500 years previously. Uh and it's still under the authority of an imperial under the authority of an imperial under the authority of an imperial power. uh and uh the uh its problem in a power. uh and uh the uh its problem in a power. uh and uh the uh its problem in a way or one aspect of its problem is that way or one aspect of its problem is that way or one aspect of its problem is that it sits in between Syria and Egypt as it sits in between Syria and Egypt as it sits in between Syria and Egypt as Israel does now.

Israel does now. Israel does now. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> And the Syrian Empire and the Egyptian >> And the Syrian Empire and the Egyptian >> And the Syrian Empire and the Egyptian Empire are usually fighting each other Empire are usually fighting each other Empire are usually fighting each other and um Israel, Jerusalem is the dog's and um Israel, Jerusalem is the dog's and um Israel, Jerusalem is the dog's bone in between these two dogs. M uh and bone in between these two dogs. M uh and bone in between these two dogs. M uh and so they are they are each of them trying so they are they are each of them trying so they are they are each of them trying to make sure that they get that they get to make sure that they get that they get to make sure that they get that they get control of Israel because it's useful um control of Israel because it's useful um control of Israel because it's useful um with them being in between. And so they with them being in between. And so they with them being in between. And so they want them to to to work by the by the want them to to to work by the by the want them to to to work by the by the imperial policies which includes as I imperial policies which includes as I imperial policies which includes as I said just now uh getting them to um work said just now uh getting them to um work said just now uh getting them to um work by the kind of religious policies um of by the kind of religious policies um of by the kind of religious policies um of whoever's in charge at the time and whoever's in charge at the time and whoever's in charge at the time and therefore not to do the kind of thing therefore not to do the kind of thing therefore not to do the kind of thing that the Torah says that the scriptures that the Torah says that the scriptures that the Torah says that the scriptures say about the way in which you should say about the way in which you should say about the way in which you should worship God. So the question is are the worship God. So the question is are the worship God. So the question is are the people in Jerusalem going to carry on people in Jerusalem going to carry on people in Jerusalem going to carry on worshiping God in accordance with the worshiping God in accordance with the worshiping God in accordance with the scriptures? scriptures? scriptures? >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> And the promises the visions are >> And the promises the visions are >> And the promises the visions are reassurances that the ways in which God reassurances that the ways in which God reassurances that the ways in which God has been involved in the history that's has been involved in the history that's has been involved in the history that's been unfurling uh in the period up to been unfurling uh in the period up to been unfurling uh in the period up to the second century God is in control of the second century God is in control of the second century God is in control of and God knows about um and that God is and God knows about um and that God is and God knows about um and that God is going to stay faithful to them. Mhm. And going to stay faithful to them. Mhm. And going to stay faithful to them. Mhm. And Daniel is one of the first instances, if Daniel is one of the first instances, if Daniel is one of the first instances, if not the first instance, if you're not the first instance, if you're not the first instance, if you're reading from Genesis on, of apocalyptic reading from Genesis on, of apocalyptic reading from Genesis on, of apocalyptic literature. So, what can you tell us literature. So, what can you tell us literature. So, what can you tell us about that genre of literature?

about that genre of literature? about that genre of literature? >> Um, well, sort of, except that whenever >> Um, well, sort of, except that whenever >> Um, well, sort of, except that whenever anybody whenever any of my students ask anybody whenever any of my students ask anybody whenever any of my students ask questions about apocalyptic, I say, "You questions about apocalyptic, I say, "You questions about apocalyptic, I say, "You should never use that word. Go and wash should never use that word. Go and wash should never use that word. Go and wash your mouth out." your mouth out." your mouth out." >> Okay. Well, now I got to go. I'll be >> Okay. Well, now I got to go. I'll be >> Okay. Well, now I got to go. I'll be right back. right back. right back. >> Okay. You'll be back in a minute. Okay. >> Okay. You'll be back in a minute. Okay. >> Okay. You'll be back in a minute. Okay. Nobody knows what it means. And while Nobody knows what it means. And while Nobody knows what it means. And while I'm at it, the same applies to the word I'm at it, the same applies to the word I'm at it, the same applies to the word esquetology. esquetology. esquetology. >> Nobody knows what either of these words >> Nobody knows what either of these words >> Nobody knows what either of these words mean. Or rather, lots of people have got mean. Or rather, lots of people have got mean. Or rather, lots of people have got different um views on it. Sure. Of what different um views on it. Sure. Of what different um views on it. Sure. Of what they mean. So, can you ask the question they mean. So, can you ask the question they mean. So, can you ask the question again without using the word again without using the word again without using the word apocalyptic? apocalyptic? apocalyptic? >> I will. I I I can definitely do so. So, >> I will. I I I can definitely do so. So, >> I will. I I I can definitely do so. So, how would you describe the how would you describe the how would you describe the the two genres? It seems like in the the two genres? It seems like in the the two genres? It seems like in the first genre is is is is a a narrative first genre is is is is a a narrative first genre is is is is a a narrative genre about what happened, but the genre about what happened, but the genre about what happened, but the second genre is something different. So, second genre is something different. So, second genre is something different. So, how would you describe the second genre? how would you describe the second genre? how would you describe the second genre? >> Well, they are you I don't mind you >> Well, they are you I don't mind you >> Well, they are you I don't mind you calling them apocalypses. calling them apocalypses. calling them apocalypses. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Each of the there are four the the genre >> Each of the there are four the the genre >> Each of the there are four the the genre is the apocalypse. is the apocalypse. is the apocalypse. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> And the word apocalypse means a >> And the word apocalypse means a >> And the word apocalypse means a revelation. revelation. revelation. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> The the book of revelation in the New >> The the book of revelation in the New >> The the book of revelation in the New Testament, the Greek name for it is Testament, the Greek name for it is Testament, the Greek name for it is apocalypsis.

apocalypsis. apocalypsis. >> It is a revelation. >> It is a revelation. >> It is a revelation. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Now, it is about the future. It's >> Now, it is about the future. It's >> Now, it is about the future. It's apocalyptic in that future oriented apocalyptic in that future oriented apocalyptic in that future oriented sense. But an apocalypse doesn't have to sense. But an apocalypse doesn't have to sense. But an apocalypse doesn't have to be a revelation about the future. It can be a revelation about the future. It can be a revelation about the future. It can be a revelation about anything. be a revelation about anything. be a revelation about anything. >> Uh what so what you've got in the >> Uh what so what you've got in the >> Uh what so what you've got in the visions in in Daniel is a collection of visions in in Daniel is a collection of visions in in Daniel is a collection of revelations that God g that God gives revelations that God g that God gives revelations that God g that God gives his people about what he's doing in his people about what he's doing in his people about what he's doing in history, about what he has been doing history, about what he has been doing history, about what he has been doing and what he's going to be doing. and what he's going to be doing. and what he's going to be doing. >> Okay, that's extraordinarily helpful. >> Okay, that's extraordinarily helpful. >> Okay, that's extraordinarily helpful. So, thank you for that. So, thank you for that. So, thank you for that. >> Woohoo. Should I go home now? >> Woohoo. Should I go home now? >> Woohoo. Should I go home now? >> I think we're done. Wrap it up. Um, >> I think we're done. Wrap it up. Um, >> I think we're done. Wrap it up. Um, okay. I think on that note that kind of okay. I think on that note that kind of okay. I think on that note that kind of ties us into the themes of the book. So, ties us into the themes of the book. So, ties us into the themes of the book. So, so what would you say are some of the so what would you say are some of the so what would you say are some of the major themes that we see in the book of major themes that we see in the book of major themes that we see in the book of Daniel? Daniel? Daniel? >> Well, the um as as I've said earlier, in >> Well, the um as as I've said earlier, in >> Well, the um as as I've said earlier, in a way the major theme is is that well, a way the major theme is is that well, a way the major theme is is that well, you could say it's that God reigns, but you could say it's that God reigns, but you could say it's that God reigns, but that's a bit um too kind of timeless. that's a bit um too kind of timeless. that's a bit um too kind of timeless. The point is in in the book of Daniel, The point is in in the book of Daniel, The point is in in the book of Daniel, God is reigning when it doesn't look as God is reigning when it doesn't look as God is reigning when it doesn't look as if he is and where he isn't. Uh and God if he is and where he isn't. Uh and God if he is and where he isn't. Uh and God is going to reign when he asserts his is going to reign when he asserts his is going to reign when he asserts his reign again. And that that obviously reign again. And that that obviously reign again. And that that obviously links with the way that Jesus talks links with the way that Jesus talks links with the way that Jesus talks about the the reign of God. So the um about the the reign of God. So the um about the the reign of God. So the um the book is about the way that God the book is about the way that God the book is about the way that God reigns uh on the on the big worldwide reigns uh on the on the big worldwide reigns uh on the on the big worldwide scale in terms of the histories of the scale in terms of the histories of the scale in terms of the histories of the empires Babylon, Persia, um Greece um empires Babylon, Persia, um Greece um empires Babylon, Persia, um Greece um and also how God reigns in the

and also how God reigns in the and also how God reigns in the experience of individuals like Daniel experience of individuals like Daniel experience of individuals like Daniel and his friends. and his friends. and his friends. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Mhm. >> Um and like the the people to whom the >> Um and like the the people to whom the >> Um and like the the people to whom the visions towards the end of the book are visions towards the end of the book are visions towards the end of the book are making promises. Uh and and so the making promises. Uh and and so the making promises. Uh and and so the vision is about you trusting in the vision is about you trusting in the vision is about you trusting in the declaration that God reigns. declaration that God reigns. declaration that God reigns. >> I think >> I think >> I think I love that theme. Again, I'm trying to I love that theme. Again, I'm trying to I love that theme. Again, I'm trying to put myself kind of back into put myself kind of back into put myself kind of back into >> that kind of time. And it'd be easy for >> that kind of time. And it'd be easy for >> that kind of time. And it'd be easy for somebody to question somebody to question somebody to question >> God's reign if they've seen kingdoms >> God's reign if they've seen kingdoms >> God's reign if they've seen kingdoms fall. They've seen what happened fall. They've seen what happened fall. They've seen what happened >> to Israel. They've seen a kingdom >> to Israel. They've seen a kingdom >> to Israel. They've seen a kingdom divided and then they've seen Jerusalem, divided and then they've seen Jerusalem, divided and then they've seen Jerusalem, the city of God, destroyed and rans, you the city of God, destroyed and rans, you the city of God, destroyed and rans, you know, and taken over. So, it'd be easy know, and taken over. So, it'd be easy know, and taken over. So, it'd be easy to say, well, clearly God doesn't reign. to say, well, clearly God doesn't reign. to say, well, clearly God doesn't reign. It's Babylon who reigns or whatever it It's Babylon who reigns or whatever it It's Babylon who reigns or whatever it is. is. is. >> Exactly. And so between what we've >> Exactly. And so between what we've >> Exactly. And so between what we've talked about with God's faithfulness, talked about with God's faithfulness, talked about with God's faithfulness, tying that into God's reign, I think tying that into God's reign, I think tying that into God's reign, I think that's incredibly important as a that's incredibly important as a that's incredibly important as a reminder because God gives us those reminder because God gives us those reminder because God gives us those examples like we talked about with his examples like we talked about with his examples like we talked about with his faithfulness of saying, "No, I'm still faithfulness of saying, "No, I'm still faithfulness of saying, "No, I'm still here. It was it, you know, and I warn here. It was it, you know, and I warn here. It was it, you know, and I warn and I gave you warnings. I told you what and I gave you warnings. I told you what and I gave you warnings. I told you what was going to happen. If you had listened was going to happen. If you had listened was going to happen. If you had listened to my people, if you had listened to my to my people, if you had listened to my to my people, if you had listened to my prophets, you would have known what was prophets, you would have known what was prophets, you would have known what was going, you know, what was going to going, you know, what was going to going, you know, what was going to befall if you didn't repent and return."

befall if you didn't repent and return." befall if you didn't repent and return." And yeah, I'm still here. And I'm going And yeah, I'm still here. And I'm going And yeah, I'm still here. And I'm going to show that I'm still here through the to show that I'm still here through the to show that I'm still here through the people who are are standing up for me, people who are are standing up for me, people who are are standing up for me, who who are still showing their who who are still showing their who who are still showing their faithfulness to me. I'm showing my faithfulness to me. I'm showing my faithfulness to me. I'm showing my faithfulness in and through them. And faithfulness in and through them. And faithfulness in and through them. And I'm going to continue to show that I'm I'm going to continue to show that I'm I'm going to continue to show that I'm going to reign forever. And I'm going to going to reign forever. And I'm going to going to reign forever. And I'm going to give you ex I'm going to give you give you ex I'm going to give you give you ex I'm going to give you visions of that. And I Yeah, that's visions of that. And I Yeah, that's visions of that. And I Yeah, that's incredibly powerful. incredibly powerful. incredibly powerful. But I think it's also important um that But I think it's also important um that But I think it's also important um that um the the the the grim things that come um the the the the grim things that come um the the the the grim things that come to happen to Daniel and his friends to happen to Daniel and his friends to happen to Daniel and his friends >> and the grim things that are presupposed >> and the grim things that are presupposed >> and the grim things that are presupposed in the visions that are happening under in the visions that are happening under in the visions that are happening under the um persecution of Antarctus the um persecution of Antarctus the um persecution of Antarctus Epiphies, they are happening to people Epiphies, they are happening to people Epiphies, they are happening to people who don't deserve it. M who don't deserve it. M who don't deserve it. M >> it's you can say okay the the the people >> it's you can say okay the the the people >> it's you can say okay the the the people of Judah who got sent taken off in of Judah who got sent taken off in of Judah who got sent taken off in Jerusalem when Jerusalem got destroyed Jerusalem when Jerusalem got destroyed Jerusalem when Jerusalem got destroyed in 587 and people take got taken off in 587 and people take got taken off in 587 and people take got taken off into exile they couldn't complain as into exile they couldn't complain as into exile they couldn't complain as books like Jeremiah and Ezekiel make books like Jeremiah and Ezekiel make books like Jeremiah and Ezekiel make clear clear clear >> sure >> sure >> sure >> uh but Daniel and co are the faithful >> uh but Daniel and co are the faithful >> uh but Daniel and co are the faithful guys and the guys who are getting guys and the guys who are getting guys and the guys who are getting persecuted um in the that's in the persecuted um in the that's in the persecuted um in the that's in the background of the visions in chapter 10 background of the visions in chapter 10 background of the visions in chapter 10 and 11 for instance they are the ones and 11 for instance they are the ones and 11 for instance they are the ones who are faith faithful.

who are faith faithful. who are faith faithful. >> Uh and so an important thing about the >> Uh and so an important thing about the >> Uh and so an important thing about the book is the challenge to to keep book is the challenge to to keep book is the challenge to to keep trusting in God when when God is trusting in God when when God is trusting in God when when God is choosing not to reign. choosing not to reign. choosing not to reign. >> Yeah. Sure. >> Yeah. Sure. >> Yeah. Sure. >> Um and and and when it's not your fault. >> Um and and and when it's not your fault. >> Um and and and when it's not your fault. >> No, I think >> No, I think >> No, I think >> when you because it isn't always right >> when you because it isn't always right >> when you because it isn't always right for us to castigate ourselves because for us to castigate ourselves because for us to castigate ourselves because it's our fault. Because it isn't always it's our fault. Because it isn't always it's our fault. Because it isn't always our fault. our fault. our fault. >> Sure. >> Sure. >> Sure. >> Which is the point about the book of >> Which is the point about the book of >> Which is the point about the book of Job. Really? Job. Really? Job. Really? >> Yeah. No, 100%. And that's a that's a >> Yeah. No, 100%. And that's a that's a >> Yeah. No, 100%. And that's a that's a great reminder. A part of God's great reminder. A part of God's great reminder. A part of God's Sovereignty is also like his his wisdom Sovereignty is also like his his wisdom Sovereignty is also like his his wisdom and his choice of whether to as you said and his choice of whether to as you said and his choice of whether to as you said reign or not reign or not reign or not >> whether to be sovereign. >> whether to be sovereign. >> whether to be sovereign. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> He chooses not to be sovereign. >> He chooses not to be sovereign. >> He chooses not to be sovereign. >> Wow. >> Wow. >> Wow. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. But it's just as well case because >> Yeah. But it's just as well case because >> Yeah. But it's just as well case because >> this seems to me to be really >> this seems to me to be really >> this seems to me to be really significant in terms of um Daniel and us significant in terms of um Daniel and us significant in terms of um Daniel and us cuz we live in a world in which if you cuz we live in a world in which if you cuz we live in a world in which if you look around, look around, look around, >> if you look at Sudan and Dur >> if you look at Sudan and Dur >> if you look at Sudan and Dur >> or you look at Israel and Gaza or you >> or you look at Israel and Gaza or you >> or you look at Israel and Gaza or you look at the Ukraine and Russia or loads look at the Ukraine and Russia or loads look at the Ukraine and Russia or loads of other places, you do not see God of other places, you do not see God of other places, you do not see God reigning.

reigning. reigning. uh and and that seems to me to be one of uh and and that seems to me to be one of uh and and that seems to me to be one of the most that the the particular period the most that the the particular period the most that the the particular period in which we live in which we live in which we live >> um is one in which the declarations uh >> um is one in which the declarations uh >> um is one in which the declarations uh in Daniel about God reigning are even in Daniel about God reigning are even in Daniel about God reigning are even more important than they sometimes been. more important than they sometimes been. more important than they sometimes been. >> Well, I I think that's a part of what I >> Well, I I think that's a part of what I >> Well, I I think that's a part of what I wanted to talk about next, which is what wanted to talk about next, which is what wanted to talk about next, which is what does this book teach us about God? And I does this book teach us about God? And I does this book teach us about God? And I think that's an interesting example of think that's an interesting example of think that's an interesting example of that God can choose, as you say, to that God can choose, as you say, to that God can choose, as you say, to reign or not reign, to be sovereign or reign or not reign, to be sovereign or reign or not reign, to be sovereign or not sovereign. And that is his choice not sovereign. And that is his choice not sovereign. And that is his choice and that's a part of his all and that's a part of his all and that's a part of his all powerfulness, his omnipotence is his powerfulness, his omnipotence is his powerfulness, his omnipotence is his ability to choose ability to choose ability to choose how and when he reigns. You know, I I I how and when he reigns. You know, I I I how and when he reigns. You know, I I I can understand the people saying, "Well, can understand the people saying, "Well, can understand the people saying, "Well, he always reigns. It's his choice on how he always reigns. It's his choice on how he always reigns. It's his choice on how he doss out his reign or not." he doss out his reign or not." he doss out his reign or not." >> But I think you all understand what >> But I think you all understand what >> But I think you all understand what we're saying. He he we're saying. He he we're saying. He he >> he chooses how and when to act. Um >> he chooses how and when to act. Um >> he chooses how and when to act. Um >> because that's what you're you're a >> because that's what you're you're a >> because that's what you're you're a father. You're like that with your kids. father. You're like that with your kids. father. You're like that with your kids. >> That's true. >> That's true. >> That's true. >> You choose sometimes to rain.

>> You choose sometimes to rain. >> You choose sometimes to rain. >> It's >> It's >> It's >> You choose sometimes to let them do what >> You choose sometimes to let them do what >> You choose sometimes to let them do what they want. they want. they want. >> That's That's true. And sometimes I feel >> That's That's true. And sometimes I feel >> That's That's true. And sometimes I feel rained over. That is true. rained over. That is true. rained over. That is true. >> Yeah, that's that's really good because >> Yeah, that's that's really good because >> Yeah, that's that's really good because I'm sure that God feels that. I'm sure that God feels that. I'm sure that God feels that. >> Yeah, I I'm sure he does. >> Yeah, I I'm sure he does. >> Yeah, I I'm sure he does. What else does this book teach us about What else does this book teach us about What else does this book teach us about God? God? God? >> Uh well, I think the faithfulness of God >> Uh well, I think the faithfulness of God >> Uh well, I think the faithfulness of God to um is is is the theme of those to um is is is the theme of those to um is is is the theme of those stories. Um the the boldness of God in stories. Um the the boldness of God in stories. Um the the boldness of God in the pressures that he puts us under uh I the pressures that he puts us under uh I the pressures that he puts us under uh I would say are two of the other big would say are two of the other big would say are two of the other big things. >> The boldness can you describe that a >> The boldness can you describe that a little bit? little bit? little bit? Well, he he lets um the the things that Well, he he lets um the the things that Well, he he lets um the the things that get that come to happen uh to Daniel and get that come to happen uh to Daniel and get that come to happen uh to Daniel and his friends, the things that he lets his friends, the things that he lets his friends, the things that he lets happen almost if you could say if you happen almost if you could say if you happen almost if you could say if you like what he trusts them, what he trusts like what he trusts them, what he trusts like what he trusts them, what he trusts them with because persecution, pressure them with because persecution, pressure them with because persecution, pressure um is something that that God kind of um is something that that God kind of um is something that that God kind of trusts with. Um and the same would be trusts with. Um and the same would be trusts with. Um and the same would be true about those guys in the second true about those guys in the second true about those guys in the second century in the persecution under century in the persecution under century in the persecution under Antiochus Epiphies. God, the the the Antiochus Epiphies. God, the the the Antiochus Epiphies. God, the the the Jewish community there in Jerusalem is Jewish community there in Jerusalem is Jewish community there in Jerusalem is divided between people who are willing divided between people who are willing divided between people who are willing to do what the emperor says to do what the emperor says to do what the emperor says >> and and stop worshiping in the proper >> and and stop worshiping in the proper >> and and stop worshiping in the proper way and people who say no, we're going way and people who say no, we're going way and people who say no, we're going to carry on doing what the Torah says.

to carry on doing what the Torah says. to carry on doing what the Torah says. And God, as it were, entrusts the And God, as it were, entrusts the And God, as it were, entrusts the decision about which to do decision about which to do decision about which to do >> and then entrusts the consequ consequent >> and then entrusts the consequ consequent >> and then entrusts the consequ consequent persecution to those guys. persecution to those guys. persecution to those guys. Yeah, I think it's it's helpful to Yeah, I think it's it's helpful to Yeah, I think it's it's helpful to remember that this is a God who has remember that this is a God who has remember that this is a God who has already seen and written the end of the already seen and written the end of the already seen and written the end of the story. So if we can so so God knows when story. So if we can so so God knows when story. So if we can so so God knows when to allow things to happen and when he to allow things to happen and when he to allow things to happen and when he needs to maneuver things because he needs to maneuver things because he needs to maneuver things because he exists outside of time and has already exists outside of time and has already exists outside of time and has already seen how everything is going to take seen how everything is going to take seen how everything is going to take shape. So, so for us it's a, you know, shape. So, so for us it's a, you know, shape. So, so for us it's a, you know, it can be hard to, you know, because all it can be hard to, you know, because all it can be hard to, you know, because all we see is what's happening right here we see is what's happening right here we see is what's happening right here and now. We can't see the effect that's and now. We can't see the effect that's and now. We can't see the effect that's going to have in the future. So, all we going to have in the future. So, all we going to have in the future. So, all we all we see is the immediate impact of a all we see is the immediate impact of a all we see is the immediate impact of a decision on our lives at this moment. decision on our lives at this moment. decision on our lives at this moment. Whereas God says, I'm going to allow Whereas God says, I'm going to allow Whereas God says, I'm going to allow this to happen. Yeah. Go ahead. this to happen. Yeah. Go ahead. this to happen. Yeah. Go ahead. >> That's a very important um aspect of the >> That's a very important um aspect of the >> That's a very important um aspect of the theme of Daniel that what you said about theme of Daniel that what you said about theme of Daniel that what you said about I've lost your words now, but it was I've lost your words now, but it was I've lost your words now, but it was good. He knows the end. Yeah, he he he good. He knows the end. Yeah, he he he good. He knows the end. Yeah, he he he he's got the end in his mind.

he's got the end in his mind. he's got the end in his mind. >> And that and in a way that would be >> And that and in a way that would be >> And that and in a way that would be another way of summarizing what the book another way of summarizing what the book another way of summarizing what the book of Daniel is about. Particularly the of Daniel is about. Particularly the of Daniel is about. Particularly the vision end anyway because what he says vision end anyway because what he says vision end anyway because what he says is, "Okay, you're in a mess. You're is, "Okay, you're in a mess. You're is, "Okay, you're in a mess. You're being persecuted, but I know the end." being persecuted, but I know the end." being persecuted, but I know the end." Yeah. And I promise you the end is going Yeah. And I promise you the end is going Yeah. And I promise you the end is going to be okay. to be okay. to be okay. >> Yeah. And we'll see that throughout. And >> Yeah. And we'll see that throughout. And >> Yeah. And we'll see that throughout. And it's it it can it can feel hard in it's it it can it can feel hard in it's it it can it can feel hard in especially in reading through Old especially in reading through Old especially in reading through Old Testament and the major prophets Testament and the major prophets Testament and the major prophets especially. It can feel hard because especially. It can feel hard because especially. It can feel hard because there were people who were suffering at there were people who were suffering at there were people who were suffering at this time. There were people who were this time. There were people who were this time. There were people who were truly suffering through the fall, truly suffering through the fall, truly suffering through the fall, through exile, through being cast into a through exile, through being cast into a through exile, through being cast into a different society. There were people who different society. There were people who different society. There were people who were killed. There were people who were were killed. There were people who were were killed. There were people who were put into all different types of put into all different types of put into all different types of persecution at this moment. And so it persecution at this moment. And so it persecution at this moment. And so it can be hard for us sometimes to say, can be hard for us sometimes to say, can be hard for us sometimes to say, well, God chose to allow this to happen. well, God chose to allow this to happen. well, God chose to allow this to happen. even though he knows the end, he still even though he knows the end, he still even though he knows the end, he still chose allow this to happen to people at chose allow this to happen to people at chose allow this to happen to people at that time. And yes, that is a part of that time. And yes, that is a part of that time. And yes, that is a part of the problem of pain and suffering that the problem of pain and suffering that the problem of pain and suffering that we wrestle with and deal with and how we wrestle with and deal with and how we wrestle with and deal with and how that relates to God's providence. So, I that relates to God's providence. So, I that relates to God's providence. So, I don't want to ignore that. I don't want don't want to ignore that. I don't want don't want to ignore that. I don't want to I can imagine people saying, "Well, to I can imagine people saying, "Well, to I can imagine people saying, "Well, that's easy enough for God to say, I'm that's easy enough for God to say, I'm that's easy enough for God to say, I'm the one living it or whatever." But we the one living it or whatever." But we the one living it or whatever." But we have a God who has proven over and over have a God who has proven over and over have a God who has proven over and over again that he not that he not only knows again that he not that he not only knows again that he not that he not only knows but he intimately cares about us and and but he intimately cares about us and and but he intimately cares about us and and yes he does allow things to happen and yes he does allow things to happen and yes he does allow things to happen and again allows things to happen a lot of again allows things to happen a lot of again allows things to happen a lot of it's it's it's the choices that we make

it's it's it's the choices that we make it's it's it's the choices that we make um that bring about a lot of times um that bring about a lot of times um that bring about a lot of times sometimes it's not the choices that we sometimes it's not the choices that we sometimes it's not the choices that we make as we talked about sometimes things make as we talked about sometimes things make as we talked about sometimes things befall and God allows things to befall befall and God allows things to befall befall and God allows things to befall um but but ultimately That's where that um but but ultimately That's where that um but but ultimately That's where that faith comes in. That faith moment in faith comes in. That faith moment in faith comes in. That faith moment in that trusting in who God is, his that trusting in who God is, his that trusting in who God is, his goodness, his faithfulness, his justice, goodness, his faithfulness, his justice, goodness, his faithfulness, his justice, all of these things will ultimately all of these things will ultimately all of these things will ultimately reign how he desires them to reign. reign how he desires them to reign. reign how he desires them to reign. That's the ultimate that's that thy will That's the ultimate that's that thy will That's the ultimate that's that thy will be done. You know, thy kingdom come, thy be done. You know, thy kingdom come, thy be done. You know, thy kingdom come, thy will be done on earth as it is in will be done on earth as it is in will be done on earth as it is in heaven. Because so often it isn't done heaven. Because so often it isn't done heaven. Because so often it isn't done on earth as it is in heaven. So, we pray on earth as it is in heaven. So, we pray on earth as it is in heaven. So, we pray for that. We yearn for that. So, I just for that. We yearn for that. So, I just for that. We yearn for that. So, I just wanted to acknowledge that. I didn't wanted to acknowledge that. I didn't wanted to acknowledge that. I didn't want to get through this without want to get through this without want to get through this without acknowledging that. Um, so I love what acknowledging that. Um, so I love what acknowledging that. Um, so I love what Daniel teaches us about God. As we said, Daniel teaches us about God. As we said, Daniel teaches us about God. As we said, it's a book about the kingdom of God. it's a book about the kingdom of God. it's a book about the kingdom of God. It's a book about God's providence. It's It's a book about God's providence. It's It's a book about God's providence. It's about his his reign and how he chooses about his his reign and how he chooses about his his reign and how he chooses to operate it. What does Daniel teach us to operate it. What does Daniel teach us to operate it. What does Daniel teach us about people, about ourselves? >> I don't know that it does very much >> I don't know that it does very much really. really. really. >> I think that's the best answer I've >> I think that's the best answer I've >> I think that's the best answer I've heard in all these. Yeah. I'm not really heard in all these. Yeah. I'm not really heard in all these. Yeah. I'm not really sure if it does.

sure if it does. sure if it does. >> It's not It's not about us. >> It's not It's not about us. >> It's not It's not about us. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. It's offering it's offering us a vision It's offering it's offering us a vision It's offering it's offering us a vision in a loose sense in in more than one in a loose sense in in more than one in a loose sense in in more than one sense. It's offering us a vision of who sense. It's offering us a vision of who sense. It's offering us a vision of who of who God is and how God relates in the of who God is and how God relates in the of who God is and how God relates in the person in a personal way uh and in that person in a personal way uh and in that person in a personal way uh and in that kind of more worldwide long long-term kind of more worldwide long long-term kind of more worldwide long long-term way. Um I suppose if we find if we find way. Um I suppose if we find if we find way. Um I suppose if we find if we find ourselves there but um I can't ourselves there but um I can't ourselves there but um I can't immediately think um I don't immediately immediately think um I don't immediately immediately think um I don't immediately think when I read it, oh I found out think when I read it, oh I found out think when I read it, oh I found out about me. I'm more fine about things about me. I'm more fine about things about me. I'm more fine about things that um that I want to be or that I wish that um that I want to be or that I wish that um that I want to be or that I wish I was that I should be and that I could I was that I should be and that I could I was that I should be and that I could be. be. be. >> I was going to Yeah, >> I was going to Yeah, >> I was going to Yeah, >> I was going to say I think it poses a >> I was going to say I think it poses a >> I was going to say I think it poses a question. It almost puts up a little bit question. It almost puts up a little bit question. It almost puts up a little bit of a mirror and poses a question both of a mirror and poses a question both of a mirror and poses a question both with Daniel and his friends is are you with Daniel and his friends is are you with Daniel and his friends is are you somebody like like how would you act in somebody like like how would you act in somebody like like how would you act in this case? this case? this case? >> Yeah. Yeah. Sure. Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. Sure. Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. Sure. Yeah. >> You know that kind of thing. >> You know that kind of thing. >> You know that kind of thing. if that's what you mean by if that's what you mean by if that's what you mean by >> well I mean >> well I mean >> well I mean >> telling us things about us >> telling us things about us >> telling us things about us >> sure it's one way that it reads back to >> sure it's one way that it reads back to >> sure it's one way that it reads back to us for sure um but no I think ultimately us for sure um but no I think ultimately us for sure um but no I think ultimately you're right it's not a book about you're right it's not a book about you're right it's not a book about humanity humanity humanity I think you're I think you're right I think you're I think you're right I think you're I think you're right about that it's it's not a book that about that it's it's not a book that about that it's it's not a book that like here's all the lessons about how like here's all the lessons about how like here's all the lessons about how people are people are people are >> oh here's a lesson about humanity oh >> oh here's a lesson about humanity oh >> oh here's a lesson about humanity oh there we go do it there we go do it there we go do it >> which is particularly not least in >> which is particularly not least in >> which is particularly not least in chapter um 11 really that the kind of chapter um 11 really that the kind of chapter um 11 really that the kind of mess of international relationships that mess of international relationships that mess of international relationships that uh the chapter 11 gives you is the mess uh the chapter 11 gives you is the mess uh the chapter 11 gives you is the mess of international relationships that we

of international relationships that we of international relationships that we are reading about and seeing on TV all are reading about and seeing on TV all are reading about and seeing on TV all the time. the time. the time. >> So it tells us yeah the yeah you in your >> So it tells us yeah the yeah you in your >> So it tells us yeah the yeah you in your world in the international relationships world in the international relationships world in the international relationships are in a mess. are in a mess. are in a mess. >> Can you give the listener a quick little >> Can you give the listener a quick little >> Can you give the listener a quick little overview of what you're talking about overview of what you're talking about overview of what you're talking about that it's talking about in Daniel 11 that it's talking about in Daniel 11 that it's talking about in Daniel 11 about the international relationship? about the international relationship? about the international relationship? It's um the the the visions they they It's um the the the visions they they It's um the the the visions they they they take you through the um history of they take you through the um history of they take you through the um history of the in outline the history of the the in outline the history of the the in outline the history of the Babylonian Persian uh empires and then Babylonian Persian uh empires and then Babylonian Persian uh empires and then Alexander the Great the beginning of Alexander the Great the beginning of Alexander the Great the beginning of chapter 11. Alexander the Great happens chapter 11. Alexander the Great happens chapter 11. Alexander the Great happens um and and then of course dies very soon um and and then of course dies very soon um and and then of course dies very soon after he creates his empire. after he creates his empire. after he creates his empire. >> His empire then divides into four parts >> His empire then divides into four parts >> His empire then divides into four parts between his generals. It's it's very between his generals. It's it's very between his generals. It's it's very kind of typical just reading about kind of typical just reading about kind of typical just reading about members all the time really and and as I members all the time really and and as I members all the time really and and as I said just now two of them are the ones said just now two of them are the ones said just now two of them are the ones that are on either side of Israel Syria that are on either side of Israel Syria that are on either side of Israel Syria roughly what we mean by Syria uh and roughly what we mean by Syria uh and roughly what we mean by Syria uh and Egypt what we mean by Egypt.

Egypt what we mean by Egypt. Egypt what we mean by Egypt. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Um and so the next um number of decades >> Um and so the next um number of decades >> Um and so the next um number of decades uh is an ongoing battle between these uh is an ongoing battle between these uh is an ongoing battle between these two. two. two. >> Yeah. um in which one some sometimes >> Yeah. um in which one some sometimes >> Yeah. um in which one some sometimes one's winning and sometimes the other one's winning and sometimes the other one's winning and sometimes the other one's winning and they're marrying each one's winning and they're marrying each one's winning and they're marrying each other off marrying into each other's other off marrying into each other's other off marrying into each other's it's kind of it's just what you're it's kind of it's just what you're it's kind of it's just what you're reading about all the time in the reading about all the time in the reading about all the time in the newspapers newspapers newspapers >> I was going to say sounds very familiar >> I was going to say sounds very familiar >> I was going to say sounds very familiar >> yeah yeah it is yeah >> yeah yeah it is yeah >> yeah yeah it is yeah >> so >> so >> so >> and and what the what the vision is >> and and what the what the vision is >> and and what the what the vision is saying is don't worry I know this looks saying is don't worry I know this looks saying is don't worry I know this looks extremely scary I know you've gone extremely scary I know you've gone extremely scary I know you've gone through this and it's grim but don't through this and it's grim but don't through this and it's grim but don't worry I I I know about it worry I I I know about it worry I I I know about it >> I'm in charge of >> I'm in charge of >> I'm in charge of Okay. So, so through the through the Okay. So, so through the through the Okay. So, so through the through the first half of all of these conversations first half of all of these conversations first half of all of these conversations about books of the Bible going through about books of the Bible going through about books of the Bible going through Chronicles, we used to ask the question Chronicles, we used to ask the question Chronicles, we used to ask the question if you can highlight two or three people if you can highlight two or three people if you can highlight two or three people that are worth highlighting or flagging that are worth highlighting or flagging that are worth highlighting or flagging for us to be aware of. for us to be aware of. for us to be aware of. >> When we got to the prophets, we well and >> When we got to the prophets, we well and >> When we got to the prophets, we well and the wisdom literature, we shifted that the wisdom literature, we shifted that the wisdom literature, we shifted that to be talking about to be talking about to be talking about >> verses or passages that are worth >> verses or passages that are worth >> verses or passages that are worth highlighting. So, I want to offer both highlighting. So, I want to offer both highlighting. So, I want to offer both up to you and you can take it however up to you and you can take it however up to you and you can take it however you want because Daniel has both.

you want because Daniel has both. you want because Daniel has both. There's, you know, there it's it's it's There's, you know, there it's it's it's There's, you know, there it's it's it's a book of a prophet, but there's also a a book of a prophet, but there's also a a book of a prophet, but there's also a cast of characters in it. cast of characters in it. cast of characters in it. >> So, >> So, >> So, >> yeah. >> yeah. >> yeah. >> Would you be able to highlight for us >> Would you be able to highlight for us >> Would you be able to highlight for us two or three verses, people, passages, two or three verses, people, passages, two or three verses, people, passages, however you want to take it, that you however you want to take it, that you however you want to take it, that you think are worth particular think are worth particular think are worth particular consideration for the reader? consideration for the reader? consideration for the reader? >> Yeah. Uh, okay. The the the story about >> Yeah. Uh, okay. The the the story about >> Yeah. Uh, okay. The the the story about the three friends. Yeah. the three friends. Yeah. the three friends. Yeah. >> Who are threatened with the um fiery >> Who are threatened with the um fiery >> Who are threatened with the um fiery furnace. Um when they are threatened furnace. Um when they are threatened furnace. Um when they are threatened with the fiery furnace, then um with the fiery furnace, then um with the fiery furnace, then um the king says to them, the king says to them, the king says to them, uh if you uh don't do what I say, you're uh if you uh don't do what I say, you're uh if you uh don't do what I say, you're going to get thrown into a furn of of of going to get thrown into a furn of of of going to get thrown into a furn of of of blazing fire. And they say to him, blazing fire. And they say to him, blazing fire. And they say to him, Nebuchadnezzar, we have no need to Nebuchadnezzar, we have no need to Nebuchadnezzar, we have no need to present a defense to you in this matter. present a defense to you in this matter. present a defense to you in this matter. If our God is a whom we serve is able to If our God is a whom we serve is able to If our God is a whom we serve is able to deliver us from the furnace of blazing deliver us from the furnace of blazing deliver us from the furnace of blazing fire and out of your hand, O king, let fire and out of your hand, O king, let fire and out of your hand, O king, let him deliver us. But if not, be it known him deliver us. But if not, be it known him deliver us. But if not, be it known to us, O king, be known to you, oh king, to us, O king, be known to you, oh king, to us, O king, be known to you, oh king, that we will not serve your gods and that we will not serve your gods and that we will not serve your gods and will not worship the golden statue that will not worship the golden statue that will not worship the golden statue that you've set up. They are looking in the you've set up. They are looking in the you've set up. They are looking in the face the question whether God will face the question whether God will face the question whether God will actually rescue them. And they are actually rescue them. And they are actually rescue them. And they are saying even if he doesn't, we're still saying even if he doesn't, we're still saying even if he doesn't, we're still going to serve him.

going to serve him. going to serve him. >> Yeah. And I think that's one of the >> Yeah. And I think that's one of the >> Yeah. And I think that's one of the bravest uh statements that there is in bravest uh statements that there is in bravest uh statements that there is in the entire scripture. I think it's it's the entire scripture. I think it's it's the entire scripture. I think it's it's brilliant brilliant brilliant >> 100%. Yeah. >> 100%. Yeah. >> 100%. Yeah. >> Yeah. And the equivalent one in um uh in >> Yeah. And the equivalent one in um uh in >> Yeah. And the equivalent one in um uh in in in the Daniel story in in Daniel's in in the Daniel story in in Daniel's in in the Daniel story in in Daniel's own story in chapter 6 when he's put own story in chapter 6 when he's put own story in chapter 6 when he's put under pressure and he's going to be put under pressure and he's going to be put under pressure and he's going to be put into the um lion furnace. The is the into the um lion furnace. The is the into the um lion furnace. The is the king says um okay, nobody's allowed to king says um okay, nobody's allowed to king says um okay, nobody's allowed to pray or ask of any uh anything of pray or ask of any uh anything of pray or ask of any uh anything of anybody apart from me. Uh and so Daniel anybody apart from me. Uh and so Daniel anybody apart from me. Uh and so Daniel goes um back home and and goes and goes um back home and and goes and goes um back home and and goes and stands on his balcony facing towards stands on his balcony facing towards stands on his balcony facing towards Jerusalem and prays to God um facing Jerusalem and prays to God um facing Jerusalem and prays to God um facing towards Jerusalem the same way as he towards Jerusalem the same way as he towards Jerusalem the same way as he always have done. always have done. always have done. >> Um despite the fact that the king has >> Um despite the fact that the king has >> Um despite the fact that the king has just made explicit that anybody who does just made explicit that anybody who does just made explicit that anybody who does that is going to end up uh in the to the that is going to end up uh in the to the that is going to end up uh in the to the lions. Um and and Daniel's bravery um in lions. Um and and Daniel's bravery um in lions. Um and and Daniel's bravery um in doing that is is just like that of his doing that is is just like that of his doing that is is just like that of his friends. It's um a fantastically friends. It's um a fantastically friends. It's um a fantastically a fantastic challenge, but an a fantastic challenge, but an a fantastic challenge, but an encouraging challenge in light of who encouraging challenge in light of who encouraging challenge in light of who they are and of the way in which God is they are and of the way in which God is they are and of the way in which God is faithful to them. So, those are two of faithful to them. So, those are two of faithful to them. So, those are two of my standout verses out of the book.

my standout verses out of the book. my standout verses out of the book. >> There are two people that have come to >> There are two people that have come to >> There are two people that have come to my mind that we we've maybe we've my mind that we we've maybe we've my mind that we we've maybe we've mentioned their names even just now, but mentioned their names even just now, but mentioned their names even just now, but we haven't really talked and I'm just we haven't really talked and I'm just we haven't really talked and I'm just curious um if you could give us a little curious um if you could give us a little curious um if you could give us a little bit of a primer on how to understand bit of a primer on how to understand bit of a primer on how to understand them. And those are the two kings that them. And those are the two kings that them. And those are the two kings that we really see. Nebuchadnezzar and we really see. Nebuchadnezzar and we really see. Nebuchadnezzar and Darius. What can we know about them? Darius. What can we know about them? Darius. What can we know about them? Uh well, Nebuchadnezzar Uh well, Nebuchadnezzar Uh well, Nebuchadnezzar uh was the the the great uh emperor of uh was the the the great uh emperor of uh was the the the great uh emperor of Babylon uh from towards the end of the Babylon uh from towards the end of the Babylon uh from towards the end of the sixth century through to the middle of sixth century through to the middle of sixth century through to the middle of the I'm sorry towards the end of the the I'm sorry towards the end of the the I'm sorry towards the end of the seventh century uh on well into the seventh century uh on well into the seventh century uh on well into the sixth who is a huge emperor um and is sixth who is a huge emperor um and is sixth who is a huge emperor um and is well amazingly um well amazingly um well amazingly um Jeremiah describes him as God's servant. Jeremiah describes him as God's servant. Jeremiah describes him as God's servant. >> Yeah. Now, he didn't think he was being >> Yeah. Now, he didn't think he was being >> Yeah. Now, he didn't think he was being God's servant. As far as he was God's servant. As far as he was God's servant. As far as he was concerned, like any emperor or king, concerned, like any emperor or king, concerned, like any emperor or king, he's selling his own nest. He's doing he's selling his own nest. He's doing he's selling his own nest. He's doing he's doing doing the best thing for his he's doing doing the best thing for his he's doing doing the best thing for his people and whatnot. people and whatnot. people and whatnot. >> But unbeknown um to him, he's actually >> But unbeknown um to him, he's actually >> But unbeknown um to him, he's actually doing God's work, doing God's work, doing God's work, >> which is another >> which is another >> which is another um encouraging insight on our world um encouraging insight on our world um encouraging insight on our world today that the people you think are the today that the people you think are the today that the people you think are the people who are cleaning working against people who are cleaning working against people who are cleaning working against God might be working for God without God might be working for God without God might be working for God without them knowing it, without you realizing them knowing it, without you realizing them knowing it, without you realizing it.

it. it. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Uh I didn't mention Das. You did. He's Uh I didn't mention Das. You did. He's Uh I didn't mention Das. You did. He's uh that's more he doesn't um he's not uh that's more he doesn't um he's not uh that's more he doesn't um he's not actually named actually named actually named >> as far as Oh yeah, he is named Peace >> as far as Oh yeah, he is named Peace >> as far as Oh yeah, he is named Peace Pod. Um uh he the he is the the second Pod. Um uh he the he is the the second Pod. Um uh he the he is the the second great Persian emperor after King Cyrus. great Persian emperor after King Cyrus. great Persian emperor after King Cyrus. Um and the Persians have create Cyrus Um and the Persians have create Cyrus Um and the Persians have create Cyrus creates and das continues an even bigger creates and das continues an even bigger creates and das continues an even bigger empire than the Babylonian one. um empire than the Babylonian one. um empire than the Babylonian one. um coming from further east from Iran and coming from further east from Iran and coming from further east from Iran and taking over adding to the Meo Persian taking over adding to the Meo Persian taking over adding to the Meo Persian Empire, the Babylonian Empire. So he's Empire, the Babylonian Empire. So he's Empire, the Babylonian Empire. So he's an even bigger fish whom again um the an even bigger fish whom again um the an even bigger fish whom again um the the visions say uh I'm going to put him the visions say uh I'm going to put him the visions say uh I'm going to put him down and God does cuz cuz Alexander in down and God does cuz cuz Alexander in down and God does cuz cuz Alexander in due course comes along and destroys that due course comes along and destroys that due course comes along and destroys that empire too. empire too. empire too. >> What do we think happens? So with the >> What do we think happens? So with the >> What do we think happens? So with the story of Nebuchadnezzar and the fiery story of Nebuchadnezzar and the fiery story of Nebuchadnezzar and the fiery furnace for example, right? He sees the furnace for example, right? He sees the furnace for example, right? He sees the fourth person inside the you know inside fourth person inside the you know inside fourth person inside the you know inside the fiery furnace his friends you know the fiery furnace his friends you know the fiery furnace his friends you know the friends come out. What do we think the friends come out. What do we think the friends come out. What do we think happens from that point on happens from that point on happens from that point on >> and Nebuchadnezzar's heart? Oh. Um, >> and Nebuchadnezzar's heart? Oh. Um, >> and Nebuchadnezzar's heart? Oh. Um, well, he he's the way the stories are well, he he's the way the stories are well, he he's the way the stories are told, um, he, uh, he recognizes what's told, um, he, uh, he recognizes what's told, um, he, uh, he recognizes what's gone on.

gone on. gone on. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> But he doesn't seem to be any better. >> But he doesn't seem to be any better. >> But he doesn't seem to be any better. And he and he he doesn't need to And he and he he doesn't need to And he and he he doesn't need to remember the day after. remember the day after. remember the day after. >> Isn't that fascinating? Yeah. >> Isn't that fascinating? Yeah. >> Isn't that fascinating? Yeah. >> Oh, what a surprise. >> Oh, what a surprise. >> Oh, what a surprise. >> Well, that's a miracle. Your God saved >> Well, that's a miracle. Your God saved >> Well, that's a miracle. Your God saved you. Oh, well, back to normal things. you. Oh, well, back to normal things. you. Oh, well, back to normal things. >> Yeah, that's right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah, that's right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah, that's right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. >> Isn't that fascinating? And I mean it's >> Isn't that fascinating? And I mean it's >> Isn't that fascinating? And I mean it's >> so though an interesting in between um >> so though an interesting in between um >> so though an interesting in between um those two stories about the fiery those two stories about the fiery those two stories about the fiery furnace and the um and the lions. furnace and the um and the lions. furnace and the um and the lions. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Is the is Belshazzer and the writing on >> Is the is Belshazzer and the writing on >> Is the is Belshazzer and the writing on the wall. the wall. the wall. >> Oh, I thought we would get to that in >> Oh, I thought we would get to that in >> Oh, I thought we would get to that in the next part about sticky parts, but the next part about sticky parts, but the next part about sticky parts, but yes, please. yes, please. yes, please. >> Okay. Okay. where where Belshazza's >> Okay. Okay. where where Belshazza's >> Okay. Okay. where where Belshazza's where the queen mother at the time says, where the queen mother at the time says, where the queen mother at the time says, "Well, when when when Daniel um when "Well, when when when Daniel um when "Well, when when when Daniel um when when when when your dad, it wasn't when when when your dad, it wasn't when when when your dad, it wasn't literally his dad, but his predecessor literally his dad, but his predecessor literally his dad, but his predecessor um Nebuchadnezzar um had pointed out to um Nebuchadnezzar um had pointed out to um Nebuchadnezzar um had pointed out to him what was going on, he repented. him what was going on, he repented. him what was going on, he repented. >> You ought to be doing that as well, but >> You ought to be doing that as well, but >> You ought to be doing that as well, but Belshazzar never does." Belshazzar never does." Belshazzar never does." >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> So, you know, who knows what's in >> So, you know, who knows what's in >> So, you know, who knows what's in Nebuchadnezzar's heart. Um the there's a Nebuchadnezzar's heart. Um the there's a Nebuchadnezzar's heart. Um the there's a picture of him bowing down, but that's picture of him bowing down, but that's picture of him bowing down, but that's more of a a reaffirmation of God's more of a a reaffirmation of God's more of a a reaffirmation of God's sovereignty, sovereignty, sovereignty, >> but then as far as one can tell, an >> but then as far as one can tell, an >> but then as far as one can tell, an indication that he becomes a different indication that he becomes a different indication that he becomes a different person.

person. person. >> Sure. >> Sure. >> Sure. >> Just a little bit of a another thing to >> Just a little bit of a another thing to >> Just a little bit of a another thing to think about for us, right? If we see God think about for us, right? If we see God think about for us, right? If we see God do miracles, how do we respond? But do miracles, how do we respond? But do miracles, how do we respond? But anyway, anyway, anyway, >> uh so so I mentioned that normally now >> uh so so I mentioned that normally now >> uh so so I mentioned that normally now we would talk about sticky parts, parts we would talk about sticky parts, parts we would talk about sticky parts, parts that are particularly confusing or that are particularly confusing or that are particularly confusing or difficult. Uh I I you know I mentioned difficult. Uh I I you know I mentioned difficult. Uh I I you know I mentioned that the writing on the wall kind of that the writing on the wall kind of that the writing on the wall kind of fits uh this part, but is there anything fits uh this part, but is there anything fits uh this part, but is there anything else in the book that you had wanted to else in the book that you had wanted to else in the book that you had wanted to mention or highlight here about parts mention or highlight here about parts mention or highlight here about parts that are particularly like worth an that are particularly like worth an that are particularly like worth an early conversation of hey you're going early conversation of hey you're going early conversation of hey you're going to read this and it might sound to read this and it might sound to read this and it might sound confusing or kind of crazy. So let me confusing or kind of crazy. So let me confusing or kind of crazy. So let me just unpack it for you a little bit up just unpack it for you a little bit up just unpack it for you a little bit up front. front. front. >> Um well if that's what you mean by >> Um well if that's what you mean by >> Um well if that's what you mean by sticky sticky sticky >> or you can take it however you sticky. >> or you can take it however you sticky. >> or you can take it however you sticky. >> Yeah. No, it's kind of a open open >> Yeah. No, it's kind of a open open >> Yeah. No, it's kind of a open open question. question. question. >> The entirety of the visions is kind of >> The entirety of the visions is kind of >> The entirety of the visions is kind of puzzling like that. puzzling like that. puzzling like that. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Um um and that's just tough. Sorry about >> Um um and that's just tough. Sorry about >> Um um and that's just tough. Sorry about that. But it just is. that. But it just is. that. But it just is. >> Um and all you can do is try to discover >> Um and all you can do is try to discover >> Um and all you can do is try to discover something about what the the images and something about what the the images and something about what the the images and so on in those visions would mean if so on in those visions would mean if so on in those visions would mean if you're living in that context because you're living in that context because you're living in that context because it's a good example of the if you like it's a good example of the if you like it's a good example of the if you like again the price that God God again the price that God God again the price that God God communicates to people in their context.

communicates to people in their context. communicates to people in their context. >> Mhm. So when people in a different >> Mhm. So when people in a different >> Mhm. So when people in a different context are trying to understand what context are trying to understand what context are trying to understand what God said, it's not surprising if they God said, it's not surprising if they God said, it's not surprising if they can't understand it. can't understand it. can't understand it. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> And so that that's why we try to >> And so that that's why we try to >> And so that that's why we try to discover things about the background and discover things about the background and discover things about the background and what the images would have meant. And what the images would have meant. And what the images would have meant. And you just got to do that. The the the you just got to do that. The the the you just got to do that. The the the visions are just tough from that point visions are just tough from that point visions are just tough from that point of view. of view. of view. >> Yeah. Yeah. Don't think that you're >> Yeah. Yeah. Don't think that you're >> Yeah. Yeah. Don't think that you're going to get all of them. A lot of them going to get all of them. A lot of them going to get all of them. A lot of them >> don't worry about, you know. Okay. >> don't worry about, you know. Okay. >> don't worry about, you know. Okay. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> I love that. Yeah. Tough. >> I love that. Yeah. Tough. >> I love that. Yeah. Tough. >> That's true. And that's where >> That's true. And that's where >> That's true. And that's where commentaries can come in handy. So commentaries can come in handy. So commentaries can come in handy. So that's a good place for me to plug your that's a good place for me to plug your that's a good place for me to plug your commentary again. commentary again. commentary again. >> Oh, okay. I don't mind. >> Oh, okay. I don't mind. >> Oh, okay. I don't mind. >> Um, which again is in the show notes, >> Um, which again is in the show notes, >> Um, which again is in the show notes, there will be a link to be able to there will be a link to be able to there will be a link to be able to purchase the commentary. Um, okay. So, purchase the commentary. Um, okay. So, purchase the commentary. Um, okay. So, so John, as somebody who has studied the so John, as somebody who has studied the so John, as somebody who has studied the book of Daniel, taught the book of book of Daniel, taught the book of book of Daniel, taught the book of Daniel for many, many, many years, what Daniel for many, many, many years, what Daniel for many, many, many years, what is something that you think everybody is something that you think everybody is something that you think everybody should know about the book, but maybe should know about the book, but maybe should know about the book, but maybe doesn't? doesn't? doesn't? Oh, that um Oh, that um Oh, that um well, well, well, >> well, this isn't this is a slightly >> well, this isn't this is a slightly >> well, this isn't this is a slightly different angle on that question.

different angle on that question. different angle on that question. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Um but but I suspect that many people >> Um but but I suspect that many people >> Um but but I suspect that many people don't realize don't realize don't realize >> that there's a longer version of the >> that there's a longer version of the >> that there's a longer version of the book of Daniel than the one that we have book of Daniel than the one that we have book of Daniel than the one that we have in our Bible. Okay. The Greek Bible has in our Bible. Okay. The Greek Bible has in our Bible. Okay. The Greek Bible has a longer version with three extra a longer version with three extra a longer version with three extra stories in it. Isn't that exciting? stories in it. Isn't that exciting? stories in it. Isn't that exciting? Really, they're really great stories. Really, they're really great stories. Really, they're really great stories. Uh, I mean the one of there's there's Uh, I mean the one of there's there's Uh, I mean the one of there's there's the story of um the best of them the story of um the best of them the story of um the best of them probably is the story of Susanna. probably is the story of Susanna. probably is the story of Susanna. >> Anybody called Susan who's watching this >> Anybody called Susan who's watching this >> Anybody called Susan who's watching this podcast, this is your story. podcast, this is your story. podcast, this is your story. >> So, so read the Greek version of Daniel >> So, so read the Greek version of Daniel >> So, so read the Greek version of Daniel which you'll get in some Bibles, the which you'll get in some Bibles, the which you'll get in some Bibles, the longer version because there's some longer version because there's some longer version because there's some really um some really great stories really um some really great stories really um some really great stories about Daniel that you probably don't about Daniel that you probably don't about Daniel that you probably don't know about. know about. know about. >> Interesting. Is that normally seen in >> Interesting. Is that normally seen in >> Interesting. Is that normally seen in Greek Orthodox churches? You use that Greek Orthodox churches? You use that Greek Orthodox churches? You use that word? word? word? >> Oh, Roman Catholic. Yeah. Roman Catholic >> Oh, Roman Catholic. Yeah. Roman Catholic >> Oh, Roman Catholic. Yeah. Roman Catholic or or or >> Roman Catholic. Okay. Interesting. >> Roman Catholic. Okay. Interesting. >> Roman Catholic. Okay. Interesting. >> Or orthodox. Yeah. Okay. >> Or orthodox. Yeah. Okay. >> Or orthodox. Yeah. Okay. >> I think you know. Yeah. I'm sure you >> I think you know. Yeah. I'm sure you >> I think you know. Yeah. I'm sure you would. Yeah. would. Yeah. would. Yeah. >> Yeah. Interesting. Okay. So, something >> Yeah. Interesting. Okay. So, something >> Yeah. Interesting. Okay. So, something for people to keep uh in mind or maybe for people to keep uh in mind or maybe for people to keep uh in mind or maybe to look out for. Um to look out for. Um to look out for. Um >> you know, if you want to write a good >> you know, if you want to write a good >> you know, if you want to write a good story, read some more good stories about story, read some more good stories about story, read some more good stories about how terrific these guys were, how triv how terrific these guys were, how triv how terrific these guys were, how triv were, and how terrific was the kind of were, and how terrific was the kind of were, and how terrific was the kind of thing that God did with them.

thing that God did with them. thing that God did with them. >> Mhm. Yeah, great stories. >> Mhm. Yeah, great stories. >> Mhm. Yeah, great stories. >> Can you shed a little quick light >> Can you shed a little quick light >> Can you shed a little quick light because I'm sure the people are going to because I'm sure the people are going to because I'm sure the people are going to be listening as to why they don't aren't be listening as to why they don't aren't be listening as to why they don't aren't included in a traditional biblical included in a traditional biblical included in a traditional biblical cannon. cannon. cannon. >> Um well, there are several examples. Um >> Um well, there are several examples. Um >> Um well, there are several examples. Um Esther is another one where um Esther is another one where um Esther is another one where um the the the book just carried on um the the the book just carried on um the the the book just carried on um being expanded in the Greek in the Greek being expanded in the Greek in the Greek being expanded in the Greek in the Greek version. the there the the the version version. the there the the the version version. the there the the the version that in Hebrew that in Hebrew that in Hebrew >> um uh here's a complication in brackets >> um uh here's a complication in brackets >> um uh here's a complication in brackets actually Daniel is in a mixture of actually Daniel is in a mixture of actually Daniel is in a mixture of Hebrew and Aramaic Hebrew and Aramaic Hebrew and Aramaic >> but anyway they're quite similar to each >> but anyway they're quite similar to each >> but anyway they're quite similar to each other so the version in our Bible as it other so the version in our Bible as it other so the version in our Bible as it were in Hebrew and Aramaic must have were in Hebrew and Aramaic must have were in Hebrew and Aramaic must have kind must have kind of solidified and kind must have kind of solidified and kind must have kind of solidified and stopped having things added to it uh in stopped having things added to it uh in stopped having things added to it uh in some not something like the second some not something like the second some not something like the second century century century >> whereas the version when it got >> whereas the version when it got >> whereas the version when it got translated into Greek and they got some translated into Greek and they got some translated into Greek and they got some other stories about Daniel. Those got other stories about Daniel. Those got other stories about Daniel. Those got nobody quite almost by accident.

nobody quite almost by accident. nobody quite almost by accident. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Um the the Greek Bible is longer than >> Um the the Greek Bible is longer than >> Um the the Greek Bible is longer than the uh Hebrew Aramaic Bible. the uh Hebrew Aramaic Bible. the uh Hebrew Aramaic Bible. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> And there's nothing um the it's the >> And there's nothing um the it's the >> And there's nothing um the it's the Apocrypha is the difference. There's Apocrypha is the difference. There's Apocrypha is the difference. There's nothing kind of um wicked about it. It's nothing kind of um wicked about it. It's nothing kind of um wicked about it. It's just um it just it's quite edifying. It just um it just it's quite edifying. It just um it just it's quite edifying. It can be quite can be quite can be quite um uh stimulating and interesting and um uh stimulating and interesting and um uh stimulating and interesting and edifying for you, but it's just uh a edifying for you, but it's just uh a edifying for you, but it's just uh a longer version. longer version. longer version. >> Good to know. Well, John, go ahead. Oh, >> Good to know. Well, John, go ahead. Oh, >> Good to know. Well, John, go ahead. Oh, I was going to say thank you so much for I was going to say thank you so much for I was going to say thank you so much for helping us to navigate this truly truly helping us to navigate this truly truly helping us to navigate this truly truly fascinating book of Daniel. As you said, fascinating book of Daniel. As you said, fascinating book of Daniel. As you said, a book of two parts and and both parts a book of two parts and and both parts a book of two parts and and both parts worth heavy consideration. the second worth heavy consideration. the second worth heavy consideration. the second part being a little bit more of a you part being a little bit more of a you part being a little bit more of a you got to take what you're getting kind of got to take what you're getting kind of got to take what you're getting kind of book and and and just kind of go with book and and and just kind of go with book and and and just kind of go with that. But but there's so much to learn that. But but there's so much to learn that. But but there's so much to learn as you said about the kingdom of God, as you said about the kingdom of God, as you said about the kingdom of God, about the faithfulness of God, about the about the faithfulness of God, about the about the faithfulness of God, about the providence of God. Um so thank you for providence of God. Um so thank you for providence of God. Um so thank you for helping us to navigate this. Would you helping us to navigate this. Would you helping us to navigate this. Would you mind closing us in prayer? Specifically mind closing us in prayer? Specifically mind closing us in prayer? Specifically praying for people as they read Daniel, praying for people as they read Daniel, praying for people as they read Daniel, maybe for the first time, maybe they maybe for the first time, maybe they maybe for the first time, maybe they want to pick the book back up again now want to pick the book back up again now want to pick the book back up again now after this conversation. So would you after this conversation. So would you after this conversation. So would you close us in prayer?

close us in prayer? close us in prayer? >> Sure. >> Sure. >> Sure. >> Thank you. Gracious God, we thank you so >> Thank you. Gracious God, we thank you so >> Thank you. Gracious God, we thank you so much that you are the Lord, you are the much that you are the Lord, you are the much that you are the Lord, you are the sovereign, you are the King. And as we sovereign, you are the King. And as we sovereign, you are the King. And as we look at our world in which we we often look at our world in which we we often look at our world in which we we often can't see you reigning and as we look at can't see you reigning and as we look at can't see you reigning and as we look at our individual lives when we often can't our individual lives when we often can't our individual lives when we often can't see you reigning, we pray that you will see you reigning, we pray that you will see you reigning, we pray that you will grant us the trust in you to reign. And grant us the trust in you to reign. And grant us the trust in you to reign. And we pray that you will hasten the time we pray that you will hasten the time we pray that you will hasten the time when you do reign in our world. We pray when you do reign in our world. We pray when you do reign in our world. We pray in Jesus name. Amen.