Jesus on Relationships: Family with Barry & Jess Saylor

Welcome to Deep Dive Conversations. Welcome to Deep Dive Conversations. Today we're talking all about family. Today we're talking all about family. Today we're talking all about family. And Pastor Doug is joined by Barry and And Pastor Doug is joined by Barry and And Pastor Doug is joined by Barry and Jessica Sailor. The sailors both work at Jessica Sailor. The sailors both work at Jessica Sailor. The sailors both work at One Hope, a global ministry to children, One Hope, a global ministry to children, One Hope, a global ministry to children, youth, and families. Jess serves in the youth, and families. Jess serves in the youth, and families. Jess serves in the North American region, and Barry serves North American region, and Barry serves North American region, and Barry serves in a partnership with Southeastern in a partnership with Southeastern in a partnership with Southeastern University. But also, they're raising a University. But also, they're raising a University. But also, they're raising a family and serve right here at our family and serve right here at our family and serve right here at our church in family ministry. So today church in family ministry. So today church in family ministry. So today they're going to be talking about the they're going to be talking about the they're going to be talking about the different roles in the family and how different roles in the family and how different roles in the family and how all of them play an important part in all of them play an important part in all of them play an important part in who we become. So let's jump in. who we become. So let's jump in. who we become. So let's jump in. Barry Jess, thank you for joining us on Barry Jess, thank you for joining us on Barry Jess, thank you for joining us on the podcast. We are so grateful to have the podcast. We are so grateful to have the podcast. We are so grateful to have you here to talk about the power of you here to talk about the power of you here to talk about the power of family. So before we talk about what you family. So before we talk about what you family. So before we talk about what you do, uh let's talk about who you are. Um do, uh let's talk about who you are. Um do, uh let's talk about who you are. Um who who who's Barry and who's Jess? who who who's Barry and who's Jess? who who who's Barry and who's Jess? >> Yes. So thank you so much for having us >> Yes. So thank you so much for having us >> Yes. So thank you so much for having us on. We're so excited to be here. Um, on. We're so excited to be here. Um, on. We're so excited to be here. Um, we've been married 20 years. Uh, we're we've been married 20 years. Uh, we're we've been married 20 years. Uh, we're originally from North Dakota. So, um, we originally from North Dakota. So, um, we originally from North Dakota. So, um, we are not similar to South Florida. Very are not similar to South Florida. Very are not similar to South Florida. Very similar. Uh, we have two daughters, two similar. Uh, we have two daughters, two similar. Uh, we have two daughters, two teenage daughters. They will be a teenage daughters. They will be a teenage daughters. They will be a freshman and a senior this year, which freshman and a senior this year, which freshman and a senior this year, which is really hard to believe.

is really hard to believe. is really hard to believe. >> Um, but yeah. Do you want to share a >> Um, but yeah. Do you want to share a >> Um, but yeah. Do you want to share a little bit more? little bit more? little bit more? >> Yeah. So, and we come from like a >> Yeah. So, and we come from like a >> Yeah. So, and we come from like a background of ministry. So, um, nextgen background of ministry. So, um, nextgen background of ministry. So, um, nextgen ministry, children's youth, family ministry, children's youth, family ministry, children's youth, family ministry for about a decade and a half ministry for about a decade and a half ministry for about a decade and a half and then moving into some of our and then moving into some of our and then moving into some of our research space that we'll be talking research space that we'll be talking research space that we'll be talking about today. So, yeah. about today. So, yeah. about today. So, yeah. >> So, not only you happily married, well, >> So, not only you happily married, well, >> So, not only you happily married, well, we talk about that. You're raising we talk about that. You're raising we talk about that. You're raising teenagers, God bless you, uh, but you're teenagers, God bless you, uh, but you're teenagers, God bless you, uh, but you're also research nerds. You have your PhD. also research nerds. You have your PhD. also research nerds. You have your PhD. You love research and we're here to talk You love research and we're here to talk You love research and we're here to talk about like the power of family to shape about like the power of family to shape about like the power of family to shape uh, the human soul. And so we'll jump uh, the human soul. And so we'll jump uh, the human soul. And so we'll jump into some of the research um on into some of the research um on into some of the research um on religious faith in a moment, but just religious faith in a moment, but just religious faith in a moment, but just talk about how why has God designed the talk about how why has God designed the talk about how why has God designed the family or what is the unique power of family or what is the unique power of family or what is the unique power of the family to form the human soul, the the family to form the human soul, the the family to form the human soul, the human human human >> Yeah. Yeah. I mean, a lot of it starts >> Yeah. Yeah. I mean, a lot of it starts >> Yeah. Yeah. I mean, a lot of it starts in this idea of security, right? So, um in this idea of security, right? So, um in this idea of security, right? So, um if if we're thinking academics here, if if we're thinking academics here, if if we're thinking academics here, there's there's this theory in there's there's this theory in there's there's this theory in psychology called attachment theory. Uh psychology called attachment theory. Uh psychology called attachment theory. Uh and a lot of that is where a baby and a lot of that is where a baby and a lot of that is where a baby actually starts to find their security actually starts to find their security actually starts to find their security when they cry. Is there someone there to when they cry. Is there someone there to when they cry. Is there someone there to help them? particularly they're looking help them? particularly they're looking help them? particularly they're looking for mom. Will mom respond when I cry? Um for mom. Will mom respond when I cry? Um for mom. Will mom respond when I cry? Um so there's this this whole idea of like so there's this this whole idea of like so there's this this whole idea of like cry and response, right? Like will cry and response, right? Like will cry and response, right? Like will someone respond to someone respond to someone respond to >> someone hears me? Someone sees me and >> someone hears me? Someone sees me and >> someone hears me? Someone sees me and someone cares about me.

someone cares about me. someone cares about me. >> And then that trust is there as well, >> And then that trust is there as well, >> And then that trust is there as well, right? So you have that security but right? So you have that security but right? So you have that security but then that trust that plays in there that then that trust that plays in there that then that trust that plays in there that like man when I cry um I know that I like man when I cry um I know that I like man when I cry um I know that I will get a response and then as they age will get a response and then as they age will get a response and then as they age up obviously that just continues to grow up obviously that just continues to grow up obviously that just continues to grow when your child has a need that you're when your child has a need that you're when your child has a need that you're responding and so that trust is built as responding and so that trust is built as responding and so that trust is built as well. well. well. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. I that makes me think about what >> Yeah. I that makes me think about what >> Yeah. I that makes me think about what David said about God. He said, you know, David said about God. He said, you know, David said about God. He said, you know, there was a time in my life where I there was a time in my life where I there was a time in my life where I cried out to God and he answered me. cried out to God and he answered me. cried out to God and he answered me. >> And then he says, so I'm going to cry >> And then he says, so I'm going to cry >> And then he says, so I'm going to cry out to him for the rest of my life. And out to him for the rest of my life. And out to him for the rest of my life. And it's like that trust connection of a it's like that trust connection of a it's like that trust connection of a relationship with God. relationship with God. relationship with God. >> That's forming in a family that helps >> That's forming in a family that helps >> That's forming in a family that helps children then view God. children then view God. children then view God. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> So how how else does a family form a >> So how how else does a family form a >> So how how else does a family form a child? child? child? >> Yeah. Yeah. Well, I mean, so >> Yeah. Yeah. Well, I mean, so >> Yeah. Yeah. Well, I mean, so foundationally like one of the things foundationally like one of the things foundationally like one of the things that Fuller Youth Institute, they've that Fuller Youth Institute, they've that Fuller Youth Institute, they've done a lot of research with teenagers, done a lot of research with teenagers, done a lot of research with teenagers, and they say that there are three big and they say that there are three big and they say that there are three big questions that teenagers are asking as questions that teenagers are asking as questions that teenagers are asking as they uh move through adolescence and they uh move through adolescence and they uh move through adolescence and into adulthood. And those are questions into adulthood. And those are questions into adulthood. And those are questions of purpose, belonging, and identity. Um, of purpose, belonging, and identity. Um, of purpose, belonging, and identity. Um, so questions of identity, who am I, of so questions of identity, who am I, of so questions of identity, who am I, of belonging, where do I fit? And then belonging, where do I fit? And then belonging, where do I fit? And then purpose, like what do I add to this purpose, like what do I add to this purpose, like what do I add to this world? What can I do? And these aren't world? What can I do? And these aren't world? What can I do? And these aren't questions kids are asking out loud.

questions kids are asking out loud. questions kids are asking out loud. They're questions every person really They're questions every person really They're questions every person really asks below the surface. asks below the surface. asks below the surface. >> Yes. Adults, right? So, I think there >> Yes. Adults, right? So, I think there >> Yes. Adults, right? So, I think there even times when we as adults are asking even times when we as adults are asking even times when we as adults are asking those questions. And I think you just those questions. And I think you just those questions. And I think you just see a crescendo though in those pre-teen see a crescendo though in those pre-teen see a crescendo though in those pre-teen and teenage years where those are just and teenage years where those are just and teenage years where those are just almost at a rolling boil. They're just almost at a rolling boil. They're just almost at a rolling boil. They're just searching for like, man, where do I fit? searching for like, man, where do I fit? searching for like, man, where do I fit? Where do I belong? Who am I? And I think Where do I belong? Who am I? And I think Where do I belong? Who am I? And I think it's so beautiful that the family uh it's so beautiful that the family uh it's so beautiful that the family uh helps to shape that, right? As parents, helps to shape that, right? As parents, helps to shape that, right? As parents, as caregivers, we help to give uh that as caregivers, we help to give uh that as caregivers, we help to give uh that that that sense of belonging and that that that sense of belonging and that that that sense of belonging and that purpose. And when you think about uh I purpose. And when you think about uh I purpose. And when you think about uh I particularly think about purpose and particularly think about purpose and particularly think about purpose and like where do I fit in this story and like where do I fit in this story and like where do I fit in this story and what story is it, right? And so we talk what story is it, right? And so we talk what story is it, right? And so we talk about man what does it look like to be about man what does it look like to be about man what does it look like to be at our house like what does it mean to at our house like what does it mean to at our house like what does it mean to be a sailor? And our girls understand be a sailor? And our girls understand be a sailor? And our girls understand that like as a sailor these are things that like as a sailor these are things that like as a sailor these are things that we do and maybe these are things that we do and maybe these are things that we do and maybe these are things that we don't do but it's giving them that we don't do but it's giving them that we don't do but it's giving them that sense of belonging and identity and that sense of belonging and identity and that sense of belonging and identity and definitely purpose along with that. definitely purpose along with that. definitely purpose along with that. >> Yeah. Yeah. In fact, like in that uh >> Yeah. Yeah. In fact, like in that uh >> Yeah. Yeah. In fact, like in that uh research with Fuller Youth, they what research with Fuller Youth, they what research with Fuller Youth, they what they show is that it's identity, they show is that it's identity, they show is that it's identity, belonging, and purpose, but at the belonging, and purpose, but at the belonging, and purpose, but at the center of those, not just in terms of center of those, not just in terms of center of those, not just in terms of the, you know, the the letters is the, you know, the the letters is the, you know, the the letters is belonging. And that where where a young belonging. And that where where a young belonging. And that where where a young person finds their belonging will person finds their belonging will person finds their belonging will largely shape their identity and will largely shape their identity and will largely shape their identity and will largely shape their purpose.

largely shape their purpose. largely shape their purpose. >> Uh we talk a lot to ministry leaders >> Uh we talk a lot to ministry leaders >> Uh we talk a lot to ministry leaders about this in terms of like creating about this in terms of like creating about this in terms of like creating spaces of belonging where young people spaces of belonging where young people spaces of belonging where young people can belong, but it's a huge message for can belong, but it's a huge message for can belong, but it's a huge message for families as well. families as well. families as well. >> Yes. Because if they feel uh like they >> Yes. Because if they feel uh like they >> Yes. Because if they feel uh like they belong not only in name like association belong not only in name like association belong not only in name like association but in warmth in this is this is my but in warmth in this is this is my but in warmth in this is this is my respit from this world out there that respit from this world out there that respit from this world out there that that there's so much happening. It's at that there's so much happening. It's at that there's so much happening. It's at such a you know breakneck speed. Um that such a you know breakneck speed. Um that such a you know breakneck speed. Um that belonging will be central then to belonging will be central then to belonging will be central then to decisions they make that are far beyond decisions they make that are far beyond decisions they make that are far beyond um where we might realize. um where we might realize. um where we might realize. >> So let's talk about like most parents >> So let's talk about like most parents >> So let's talk about like most parents don't get this in a manual. Hey your don't get this in a manual. Hey your don't get this in a manual. Hey your kids are going to be looking for the kids are going to be looking for the kids are going to be looking for the sense of identity, purpose, belonging. sense of identity, purpose, belonging. sense of identity, purpose, belonging. So what happens if a family's not aware So what happens if a family's not aware So what happens if a family's not aware of this or they just neglect this? If of this or they just neglect this? If of this or they just neglect this? If they're not intentional about helping they're not intentional about helping they're not intentional about helping their kids know this is who you are, their kids know this is who you are, their kids know this is who you are, this is where you belong. This is the this is where you belong. This is the this is where you belong. This is the purpose you're made for. What happens to purpose you're made for. What happens to purpose you're made for. What happens to children who don't experience that children who don't experience that children who don't experience that intentional disciplehip and training? intentional disciplehip and training? intentional disciplehip and training? >> Yeah, that's a great question. Yeah, >> Yeah, that's a great question. Yeah, >> Yeah, that's a great question. Yeah, >> I mean I think they just continue to >> I mean I think they just continue to >> I mean I think they just continue to look for it in other places, right? So look for it in other places, right? So look for it in other places, right? So similarly like if if you're not uh we similarly like if if you're not uh we similarly like if if you're not uh we like to say like get there first right like to say like get there first right like to say like get there first right with the conversation with whatever it with the conversation with whatever it with the conversation with whatever it might be if parents aren't shaping them might be if parents aren't shaping them might be if parents aren't shaping them like your your kids are being shaped. Um like your your kids are being shaped. Um like your your kids are being shaped. Um it's just a question of who or what is it's just a question of who or what is it's just a question of who or what is shaping them and especially now that we shaping them and especially now that we shaping them and especially now that we have right phones that are just a world have right phones that are just a world have right phones that are just a world in our pocket uh which is kind of in our pocket uh which is kind of in our pocket uh which is kind of terrifying. Um so yeah I mean they're terrifying. Um so yeah I mean they're terrifying. Um so yeah I mean they're they're being shaped. Um and as parents, they're being shaped. Um and as parents, they're being shaped. Um and as parents, man, we just get to have that privilege man, we just get to have that privilege man, we just get to have that privilege and that honor to be uh to kind of be and that honor to be uh to kind of be and that honor to be uh to kind of be their first to be that number one their first to be that number one their first to be that number one influence that research says that we influence that research says that we influence that research says that we are.

are. are. >> Yeah. In developmental psychology, um >> Yeah. In developmental psychology, um >> Yeah. In developmental psychology, um they talk about guard rails and that they talk about guard rails and that they talk about guard rails and that oftenimes parents are setting up guard oftenimes parents are setting up guard oftenimes parents are setting up guard rails. Yeah. rails. Yeah. rails. Yeah. >> And those are spaces that we should >> And those are spaces that we should >> And those are spaces that we should expect young people to bump up against. expect young people to bump up against. expect young people to bump up against. So we put rules in place. We put So we put rules in place. We put So we put rules in place. We put guidelines in place like this is how we guidelines in place like this is how we guidelines in place like this is how we live our lives. This is what it means to live our lives. This is what it means to live our lives. This is what it means to be a solder, right? Like we're saying be a solder, right? Like we're saying be a solder, right? Like we're saying those kinds of things. those kinds of things. those kinds of things. >> We should expect them to bump up against >> We should expect them to bump up against >> We should expect them to bump up against those. But one of the things we've seen those. But one of the things we've seen those. But one of the things we've seen in more recent years is that as adults in more recent years is that as adults in more recent years is that as adults have had less um guard rails on their have had less um guard rails on their have had less um guard rails on their own lives, they've removes removed those own lives, they've removes removed those own lives, they've removes removed those from their kids' lives as well. And a from their kids' lives as well. And a from their kids' lives as well. And a lot of devel developmental psychologists lot of devel developmental psychologists lot of devel developmental psychologists are identifying this like flailing as are identifying this like flailing as are identifying this like flailing as young people are they're just trying to young people are they're just trying to young people are they're just trying to find the boundaries so that they can find the boundaries so that they can find the boundaries so that they can find how they fit. They can find where find how they fit. They can find where find how they fit. They can find where they're supposed to kind of operate in they're supposed to kind of operate in they're supposed to kind of operate in that space. that space. that space. >> Um so yeah. So, so talk about the the >> Um so yeah. So, so talk about the the >> Um so yeah. So, so talk about the the tension between getting your kids to tension between getting your kids to tension between getting your kids to obey. Maybe sometimes you could be obey. Maybe sometimes you could be obey. Maybe sometimes you could be overly controlling or overly overly controlling or overly overly controlling or overly authoritative and sort of permissively authoritative and sort of permissively authoritative and sort of permissively letting them do whatever they want. letting them do whatever they want. letting them do whatever they want. There there's a balance there. I mean, There there's a balance there. I mean, There there's a balance there. I mean, we're talking about Jesus and we're talking about Jesus and we're talking about Jesus and relationships and we're relationships and we're relationships and we're >> we we just read, you know, the the 12 >> we we just read, you know, the the 12 >> we we just read, you know, the the 12 verses of Jesus entire childhood and one verses of Jesus entire childhood and one verses of Jesus entire childhood and one of those lines is he of those lines is he of those lines is he >> went to his parents house and he >> went to his parents house and he >> went to his parents house and he submitted to them. He obeyed and honored submitted to them. He obeyed and honored submitted to them. He obeyed and honored them. Um, so what does that look like?

them. Um, so what does that look like? them. Um, so what does that look like? Teaching our kids how to obey and honor Teaching our kids how to obey and honor Teaching our kids how to obey and honor but not be too prescriptive, too but not be too prescriptive, too but not be too prescriptive, too controlling. controlling. controlling. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Some of this is throughout stages, too, Some of this is throughout stages, too, Some of this is throughout stages, too, right? Like, like we're thinking about right? Like, like we're thinking about right? Like, like we're thinking about how we're parenting with the end goal in how we're parenting with the end goal in how we're parenting with the end goal in mind that we're parenting adults, good, mind that we're parenting adults, good, mind that we're parenting adults, good, mature adults. Now, again, you're mature adults. Now, again, you're mature adults. Now, again, you're parenting your five or six-year-old like parenting your five or six-year-old like parenting your five or six-year-old like they're going to be a 30-year-old one they're going to be a 30-year-old one they're going to be a 30-year-old one day. day. day. >> Yes. Exactly. Right. Prepare them for >> Yes. Exactly. Right. Prepare them for >> Yes. Exactly. Right. Prepare them for that way. So, um, you'll talk about the that way. So, um, you'll talk about the that way. So, um, you'll talk about the C's that that we can kind of bring C's that that we can kind of bring C's that that we can kind of bring around that conversation, but a lot of around that conversation, but a lot of around that conversation, but a lot of that is thinking, yes, at 5 years old, that is thinking, yes, at 5 years old, that is thinking, yes, at 5 years old, this is how I'm going to parent you, but this is how I'm going to parent you, but this is how I'm going to parent you, but now at 12, 13 years old, that's going to now at 12, 13 years old, that's going to now at 12, 13 years old, that's going to shift a bit because I'm trying to get shift a bit because I'm trying to get shift a bit because I'm trying to get you ready for this stage, and now I'm you ready for this stage, and now I'm you ready for this stage, and now I'm trying to get you ready for this stage. trying to get you ready for this stage. trying to get you ready for this stage. >> Yeah. So, I think when especially, you >> Yeah. So, I think when especially, you >> Yeah. So, I think when especially, you were saying when they're little, you were saying when they're little, you were saying when they're little, you really do play that commander role. Um, really do play that commander role. Um, really do play that commander role. Um, it is more of a strict ob like this is it is more of a strict ob like this is it is more of a strict ob like this is yes, no, you don't really need to give a yes, no, you don't really need to give a yes, no, you don't really need to give a lot of explanation behind that, right? lot of explanation behind that, right? lot of explanation behind that, right? they're little, they're not going to they're little, they're not going to they're little, they're not going to understand, but you want to protect understand, but you want to protect understand, but you want to protect them. You set up those more strict uh them. You set up those more strict uh them. You set up those more strict uh boundaries and those strict rules. But boundaries and those strict rules. But boundaries and those strict rules. But as they get older, a lot of parents um as they get older, a lot of parents um as they get older, a lot of parents um they they maybe forget or they don't uh they they maybe forget or they don't uh they they maybe forget or they don't uh adapt and grow with their child. So, you adapt and grow with their child. So, you adapt and grow with their child. So, you go from this commander stage and then go from this commander stage and then go from this commander stage and then you go more to a coach, right? So, you go more to a coach, right? So, you go more to a coach, right? So, they're in elementary school, they are they're in elementary school, they are they're in elementary school, they are now off uh doing their thing. And a lot now off uh doing their thing. And a lot now off uh doing their thing. And a lot of parents kind of enter a coast. Uh of parents kind of enter a coast. Uh of parents kind of enter a coast. Uh they just like to, you know, their kids they just like to, you know, their kids they just like to, you know, their kids are off doing their thing. They they are off doing their thing. They they are off doing their thing. They they should know, but really that coach should know, but really that coach should know, but really that coach should kind of do that replay. I was should kind of do that replay. I was should kind of do that replay. I was never in sports. So you tell me if this never in sports. So you tell me if this never in sports. So you tell me if this is what a coach does, right? They like is what a coach does, right? They like is what a coach does, right? They like huddle up afterwards like how did that huddle up afterwards like how did that huddle up afterwards like how did that go? Let's walk through what did you do?

go? Let's walk through what did you do? go? Let's walk through what did you do? Um and then when they hit that like Um and then when they hit that like Um and then when they hit that like pre-teen. So we're thinking this 10 to pre-teen. So we're thinking this 10 to pre-teen. So we're thinking this 10 to 14 window which is such an important 14 window which is such an important 14 window which is such an important time uh in a parent's life, in a child's time uh in a parent's life, in a child's time uh in a parent's life, in a child's life developmentally. Um you're moving life developmentally. Um you're moving life developmentally. Um you're moving into more of that counselor. And so into more of that counselor. And so into more of that counselor. And so that's going to be a little bit more that's going to be a little bit more that's going to be a little bit more open-ended. I mean your children are now open-ended. I mean your children are now open-ended. I mean your children are now going to be forming their own ideas. going to be forming their own ideas. going to be forming their own ideas. They might be different than your ideas, They might be different than your ideas, They might be different than your ideas, right? So, you're going to sense this right? So, you're going to sense this right? So, you're going to sense this maybe pushing back, which a lot of maybe pushing back, which a lot of maybe pushing back, which a lot of parents that that can feel scary. That parents that that can feel scary. That parents that that can feel scary. That can feel like your child's rejecting can feel like your child's rejecting can feel like your child's rejecting you. Um, you know this, but in you. Um, you know this, but in you. Um, you know this, but in parenting, there's a lot of stuff that's parenting, there's a lot of stuff that's parenting, there's a lot of stuff that's revealed that's actually more about you revealed that's actually more about you revealed that's actually more about you than your child, right? That the Lord than your child, right? That the Lord than your child, right? That the Lord wants to work and do a move in you. Uh, wants to work and do a move in you. Uh, wants to work and do a move in you. Uh, that is because your child has brought that is because your child has brought that is because your child has brought something up that maybe you're like, I something up that maybe you're like, I something up that maybe you're like, I I'm losing control here. What does this I'm losing control here. What does this I'm losing control here. What does this look like? Um, and so we do see uh kind look like? Um, and so we do see uh kind look like? Um, and so we do see uh kind of like where parents are really of like where parents are really of like where parents are really struggling is in that move from like struggling is in that move from like struggling is in that move from like it's easy when they're little because I it's easy when they're little because I it's easy when they're little because I can just I'm the mom and you're going to can just I'm the mom and you're going to can just I'm the mom and you're going to obey and end of story, right? But as obey and end of story, right? But as obey and end of story, right? But as they get older, our conversations and they get older, our conversations and they get older, our conversations and the way that we're talking, the way that the way that we're talking, the way that the way that we're talking, the way that we expect obedience, um, now our kids we expect obedience, um, now our kids we expect obedience, um, now our kids still know the rules. Um, but we're still know the rules. Um, but we're still know the rules. Um, but we're going to couch that so much more in going to couch that so much more in going to couch that so much more in relationship. So we always say like relationship. So we always say like relationship. So we always say like rules without relationship leads to rules without relationship leads to rules without relationship leads to rebellion. Um, and so often we see that rebellion. Um, and so often we see that rebellion. Um, and so often we see that and especially in that age if you're not and especially in that age if you're not and especially in that age if you're not expecting that like man my child is expecting that like man my child is expecting that like man my child is going to push back and are is there room going to push back and are is there room going to push back and are is there room in our relationship to have a in our relationship to have a in our relationship to have a conversation and what should that look conversation and what should that look conversation and what should that look like and sound like and then as they get like and sound like and then as they get like and sound like and then as they get even older then you're really moving even older then you're really moving even older then you're really moving into that consultant phase, right? Where into that consultant phase, right? Where into that consultant phase, right? Where where you are definitely on call as they where you are definitely on call as they where you are definitely on call as they go off to college, right? You you are in go off to college, right? You you are in go off to college, right? You you are in the stage the stage the stage >> unsolicited feedback will be taken as >> unsolicited feedback will be taken as >> unsolicited feedback will be taken as criticism.

criticism. criticism. >> Exactly. Exactly. >> Exactly. Exactly. >> Exactly. Exactly. >> I have to wait for them to call me. >> I have to wait for them to call me. >> I have to wait for them to call me. What? What? What? >> Yes. Yes. >> Yes. Yes. >> Yes. Yes. >> Okay. So I want to just stop. stop and >> Okay. So I want to just stop. stop and >> Okay. So I want to just stop. stop and and pause on this idea that not only and pause on this idea that not only and pause on this idea that not only will our children grow and change but as will our children grow and change but as will our children grow and change but as parents we have to grow and change. parents we have to grow and change. parents we have to grow and change. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> So talk about that internal process >> So talk about that internal process >> So talk about that internal process either personally or someone you know either personally or someone you know either personally or someone you know that have their kids respond a certain that have their kids respond a certain that have their kids respond a certain way they realize I need to change from way they realize I need to change from way they realize I need to change from control more to coaching or more control more to coaching or more control more to coaching or more counseling more consulting and that counseling more consulting and that counseling more consulting and that internal thing that's hard for you like internal thing that's hard for you like internal thing that's hard for you like how do you work through that? how do you work through that? how do you work through that? >> Oh gosh Doug. Yeah. Like this is >> Oh gosh Doug. Yeah. Like this is >> Oh gosh Doug. Yeah. Like this is confession time. I know that. We're confession time. I know that. We're confession time. I know that. We're raising adult children, so I'm like, raising adult children, so I'm like, raising adult children, so I'm like, "Wait, wait, this is good advice. This "Wait, wait, this is good advice. This "Wait, wait, this is good advice. This is true. This is helpful." But you don't is true. This is helpful." But you don't is true. This is helpful." But you don't want to like what what's going on. want to like what what's going on. want to like what what's going on. >> You have to be quiet. Give them space. >> You have to be quiet. Give them space. >> You have to be quiet. Give them space. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> But it's a lot of what's going on in >> But it's a lot of what's going on in >> But it's a lot of what's going on in you. Like, I thought this was my job to you. Like, I thought this was my job to you. Like, I thought this was my job to train you. train you. train you. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> I've been helping you your whole life. >> I've been helping you your whole life. >> I've been helping you your whole life. Now you don't want help. What is this? Now you don't want help. What is this? Now you don't want help. What is this? >> And and part of it is like like it's a >> And and part of it is like like it's a >> And and part of it is like like it's a posture change. We're hearing that, but posture change. We're hearing that, but posture change. We're hearing that, but it's even like a tone change so much in it's even like a tone change so much in it's even like a tone change so much in what's happening, right? So, so like what's happening, right? So, so like what's happening, right? So, so like like for me, I I I I tend to get to sit like for me, I I I I tend to get to sit like for me, I I I I tend to get to sit in rooms where I'm the expert, right?

in rooms where I'm the expert, right? in rooms where I'm the expert, right? Like I'm the professor, I'm the pastor, Like I'm the professor, I'm the pastor, Like I'm the professor, I'm the pastor, I'm the, you know, whatever that is, I'm the, you know, whatever that is, I'm the, you know, whatever that is, right? So, so like in that right? So, so like in that right? So, so like in that >> it it's it's easy for me to speak from a >> it it's it's easy for me to speak from a >> it it's it's easy for me to speak from a p a place of authority and to tell p a place of authority and to tell p a place of authority and to tell people what they should know, you know, people what they should know, you know, people what they should know, you know, that sort of a thing. Uh but we have two that sort of a thing. Uh but we have two that sort of a thing. Uh but we have two teenage girls now. Um they're not that teenage girls now. Um they're not that teenage girls now. Um they're not that interested in in that side of things as interested in in that side of things as interested in in that side of things as much. But what so what I've had to learn much. But what so what I've had to learn much. But what so what I've had to learn in in growing and changing is even in in growing and changing is even in in growing and changing is even changing my posture toward that changing my posture toward that changing my posture toward that authority. What is that authority for? authority. What is that authority for? authority. What is that authority for? And then how to use that. And actually And then how to use that. And actually And then how to use that. And actually Jess is way better at this than I am, Jess is way better at this than I am, Jess is way better at this than I am, but more like questioning questions but more like questioning questions but more like questioning questions leading them to wisdom, right? Like leading them to wisdom, right? Like leading them to wisdom, right? Like leading them to the right answer. maybe leading them to the right answer. maybe leading them to the right answer. maybe not even the exact answer I would land not even the exact answer I would land not even the exact answer I would land at, but in a a wise place, a good at, but in a a wise place, a good at, but in a a wise place, a good decision um around around things so that decision um around around things so that decision um around around things so that >> it's not just because dad said so. >> it's not just because dad said so. >> it's not just because dad said so. >> I have to do that, but it's leading them >> I have to do that, but it's leading them >> I have to do that, but it's leading them to a place of wisdom. to a place of wisdom. to a place of wisdom. >> Yeah. A lot of a lot of our conversation >> Yeah. A lot of a lot of our conversation >> Yeah. A lot of a lot of our conversation or questions around our house sound or questions around our house sound or questions around our house sound like, okay, well, what do you what do like, okay, well, what do you what do like, okay, well, what do you what do you think about that? Well, how do you you think about that? Well, how do you you think about that? Well, how do you think you handled that situation?

think you handled that situation? think you handled that situation? um how maybe should have that um how maybe should have that um how maybe should have that conversation gone with your friend or conversation gone with your friend or conversation gone with your friend or how would you have liked this person to how would you have liked this person to how would you have liked this person to talk I mean we've got sisters right so talk I mean we've got sisters right so talk I mean we've got sisters right so like they they are best friends worst like they they are best friends worst like they they are best friends worst enemies all within 10 minutes so like enemies all within 10 minutes so like enemies all within 10 minutes so like navigating how they have their navigating how they have their navigating how they have their relationships well I mean would you relationships well I mean would you relationships well I mean would you would you like to be treated that way so would you like to be treated that way so would you like to be treated that way so I'm not I'm no longer directing like be I'm not I'm no longer directing like be I'm not I'm no longer directing like be kind to your sister like they know that kind to your sister like they know that kind to your sister like they know that so how am I pulling that out of them how so how am I pulling that out of them how so how am I pulling that out of them how am I drawing that out um and as you grow am I drawing that out um and as you grow am I drawing that out um and as you grow man they just man they just man they just >> they will in turn teach you a whole lot. >> they will in turn teach you a whole lot. >> they will in turn teach you a whole lot. Um, and so there was a situation not Um, and so there was a situation not Um, and so there was a situation not long ago. Um, where my daughter I was, long ago. Um, where my daughter I was, long ago. Um, where my daughter I was, uh, they go on a lot of school trips, a uh, they go on a lot of school trips, a uh, they go on a lot of school trips, a lot of retreats. Um, and growing up, I lot of retreats. Um, and growing up, I lot of retreats. Um, and growing up, I had a lot of, uh, separation anxiety. had a lot of, uh, separation anxiety. had a lot of, uh, separation anxiety. And so, uh, I was unknowingly carrying And so, uh, I was unknowingly carrying And so, uh, I was unknowingly carrying that into this relationship. And so, I that into this relationship. And so, I that into this relationship. And so, I really wanted them to just be free and really wanted them to just be free and really wanted them to just be free and go, "Mom's not worried about you. You go, "Mom's not worried about you. You go, "Mom's not worried about you. You I'm just empowering you to go." Right? I'm just empowering you to go." Right? I'm just empowering you to go." Right? my older daughter uh she was we were my older daughter uh she was we were my older daughter uh she was we were getting ready to send our youngest on a getting ready to send our youngest on a getting ready to send our youngest on a trip and she said mom you need to put a trip and she said mom you need to put a trip and she said mom you need to put a card in her suitcase card in her suitcase card in her suitcase >> and I was like what she's like >> and I was like what she's like >> and I was like what she's like >> that's good >> that's good >> that's good >> other parents do that >> other parents do that >> other parents do that >> and she needs to know even if she >> and she needs to know even if she >> and she needs to know even if she doesn't need it and even if you are doesn't need it and even if you are doesn't need it and even if you are trying to just and I I told her I was trying to just and I I told her I was trying to just and I I told her I was like I thought like I didn't want her to like I thought like I didn't want her to like I thought like I didn't want her to think that like oh mommy misses you and think that like oh mommy misses you and think that like oh mommy misses you and you're just and I didn't want her to you're just and I didn't want her to you're just and I didn't want her to feel that sadness and she's like no no feel that sadness and she's like no no feel that sadness and she's like no no no mom no mom no mom >> she needs that cuz other kids are >> she needs that cuz other kids are >> she needs that cuz other kids are getting and by not having so there's getting and by not having so there's getting and by not having so there's just all of these teaching moments that just all of these teaching moments that just all of these teaching moments that you're like you're like you're like >> oh so much of parenting again is more >> oh so much of parenting again is more >> oh so much of parenting again is more about like am I understanding my own

about like am I understanding my own about like am I understanding my own parenting journey uh what the Lord is parenting journey uh what the Lord is parenting journey uh what the Lord is wanting to do through me and in me and wanting to do through me and in me and wanting to do through me and in me and just all the ways I can learn right and just all the ways I can learn right and just all the ways I can learn right and it's it's a very humbling process it's it's a very humbling process it's it's a very humbling process parenting's humbling parenting's humbling parenting's humbling >> it is humbling for sure >> it is humbling for sure >> it is humbling for sure >> yes so actually talk to me about this >> yes so actually talk to me about this >> yes so actually talk to me about this idea of how you let your kids teach you idea of how you let your kids teach you idea of how you let your kids teach you or or how do you respond to your kids or or how do you respond to your kids or or how do you respond to your kids when you make a mistake like what's the when you make a mistake like what's the when you make a mistake like what's the power of a parent looking at their kids power of a parent looking at their kids power of a parent looking at their kids and saying, "I'm really sorry." What and saying, "I'm really sorry." What and saying, "I'm really sorry." What does that do? does that do? does that do? >> It's everything. It's huge. Tell me >> It's everything. It's huge. Tell me >> It's everything. It's huge. Tell me more. more. more. >> My favorite uh I don't know if this is >> My favorite uh I don't know if this is >> My favorite uh I don't know if this is like the thing I want to stand up and like the thing I want to stand up and like the thing I want to stand up and preach on is is the power of the preach on is is the power of the preach on is is the power of the apology. apology. apology. >> Um and so how powerful it is to >> Um and so how powerful it is to >> Um and so how powerful it is to apologize to your kids. And so here's apologize to your kids. And so here's apologize to your kids. And so here's what I tell parents is like, man, when what I tell parents is like, man, when what I tell parents is like, man, when you look at your kids, like you just you look at your kids, like you just you look at your kids, like you just know like they're never going to be know like they're never going to be know like they're never going to be perfect. Like your kids make mistakes perfect. Like your kids make mistakes perfect. Like your kids make mistakes all the time. Um and so I also make all the time. Um and so I also make all the time. Um and so I also make mistakes all the time. So what does it mistakes all the time. So what does it mistakes all the time. So what does it look like then for my so think about for look like then for my so think about for look like then for my so think about for me for my daughters to be a mom or a me for my daughters to be a mom or a me for my daughters to be a mom or a wife uh but someone who is following wife uh but someone who is following wife uh but someone who is following Christ but who messes up like what does Christ but who messes up like what does Christ but who messes up like what does that actually look like? Yeah. that actually look like? Yeah. that actually look like? Yeah. >> And it looks like apologizing. So I I go >> And it looks like apologizing. So I I go >> And it looks like apologizing. So I I go to my girls and I probably more than you to my girls and I probably more than you to my girls and I probably more than you do because I uh speak before I think 90% do because I uh speak before I think 90% do because I uh speak before I think 90% of the time. Lord help me. Um, and so I of the time. Lord help me. Um, and so I of the time. Lord help me. Um, and so I will say things and I'm like, "Whoop, will say things and I'm like, "Whoop, will say things and I'm like, "Whoop, that was not how I wanted that to come that was not how I wanted that to come that was not how I wanted that to come out or like we've just got all kinds of out or like we've just got all kinds of out or like we've just got all kinds of hormones in our house, so that sometimes hormones in our house, so that sometimes hormones in our house, so that sometimes often plays a part, right? So we react often plays a part, right? So we react often plays a part, right? So we react how we we wouldn't want to." And so I um how we we wouldn't want to." And so I um how we we wouldn't want to." And so I um I mean, this is probably good. I've I mean, this is probably good. I've I mean, this is probably good. I've gotten really good at apologizing to my gotten really good at apologizing to my gotten really good at apologizing to my girls been like, "You know what, Mom?

girls been like, "You know what, Mom? girls been like, "You know what, Mom? That that was an overreaction. That was That that was an overreaction. That was That that was an overreaction. That was not how I wanted to handle that not how I wanted to handle that not how I wanted to handle that situation. Like, will you forgive me? situation. Like, will you forgive me? situation. Like, will you forgive me? Um, and can you will you just pray with Um, and can you will you just pray with Um, and can you will you just pray with me in this moment?" Um, and so we're me in this moment?" Um, and so we're me in this moment?" Um, and so we're always trying to like model that like, always trying to like model that like, always trying to like model that like, man, you're not going to be perfect. I'm man, you're not going to be perfect. I'm man, you're not going to be perfect. I'm not going to be perfect, but this is not going to be perfect, but this is not going to be perfect, but this is what it looks like for someone who's what it looks like for someone who's what it looks like for someone who's following after Jesus following after Jesus following after Jesus >> and who is going to just fail, but we >> and who is going to just fail, but we >> and who is going to just fail, but we know that like God has grace for us. know that like God has grace for us. know that like God has grace for us. Christ has grace for us. And so, what Christ has grace for us. And so, what Christ has grace for us. And so, what does it look like to continue to to do does it look like to continue to to do does it look like to continue to to do that forward? And hopefully there's a that forward? And hopefully there's a that forward? And hopefully there's a change in behavior, right? It's not just change in behavior, right? It's not just change in behavior, right? It's not just a flippant like, "Yep, I messed up a flippant like, "Yep, I messed up a flippant like, "Yep, I messed up again. Sorry." like, "No, I I want to again. Sorry." like, "No, I I want to again. Sorry." like, "No, I I want to model to them like, man, like I'm so model to them like, man, like I'm so model to them like, man, like I'm so sorry that like I reacted this way or I sorry that like I reacted this way or I sorry that like I reacted this way or I said that or sometimes I I will say said that or sometimes I I will say said that or sometimes I I will say things and I don't think I've said things and I don't think I've said things and I don't think I've said anything wrong, Doug. I think I said it anything wrong, Doug. I think I said it anything wrong, Doug. I think I said it right, but my daughters, they heard and right, but my daughters, they heard and right, but my daughters, they heard and they they interpreted it differently, they they interpreted it differently, they they interpreted it differently, right?" right?" right?" >> So, there's apologies that should be >> So, there's apologies that should be >> So, there's apologies that should be made in that circumstance as well. So, made in that circumstance as well. So, made in that circumstance as well. So, it's just this I think it's beautiful it's just this I think it's beautiful it's just this I think it's beautiful that we get to model that and we get to that we get to model that and we get to that we get to model that and we get to enter that space with our children that enter that space with our children that enter that space with our children that we get to to show them like this is what we get to to show them like this is what we get to to show them like this is what it looks like to be a growing uh yeah it looks like to be a growing uh yeah it looks like to be a growing uh yeah Christ follower.

Christ follower. Christ follower. >> Yeah. Let me give a picture even of how >> Yeah. Let me give a picture even of how >> Yeah. Let me give a picture even of how that's played out in in our family. Um that's played out in in our family. Um that's played out in in our family. Um like like showing how that builds like like showing how that builds like like showing how that builds wisdom, how that builds the kind of wisdom, how that builds the kind of wisdom, how that builds the kind of character we're hoping for um in our character we're hoping for um in our character we're hoping for um in our kids. Um our oldest daughter is 17 now. kids. Um our oldest daughter is 17 now. kids. Um our oldest daughter is 17 now. I think we would do this a little I think we would do this a little I think we would do this a little differently now, but I think we let her differently now, but I think we let her differently now, but I think we let her get on Instagram at 13, if I remember get on Instagram at 13, if I remember get on Instagram at 13, if I remember right, at 13 or 14. Um, and it was right, at 13 or 14. Um, and it was right, at 13 or 14. Um, and it was interesting because uh at that time we interesting because uh at that time we interesting because uh at that time we were were very like uh intentional. Uh were were very like uh intentional. Uh were were very like uh intentional. Uh we did all the things you're supposed to we did all the things you're supposed to we did all the things you're supposed to do. We had a contract. We had um you do. We had a contract. We had um you do. We had a contract. We had um you know, we we were her friends. She know, we we were her friends. She know, we we were her friends. She couldn't follow anyone she doesn't know, couldn't follow anyone she doesn't know, couldn't follow anyone she doesn't know, you know, like all all the things that you know, like all all the things that you know, like all all the things that you're supposed to do. We we did those you're supposed to do. We we did those you're supposed to do. We we did those those pretty well. Um, but it was during those pretty well. Um, but it was during those pretty well. Um, but it was during that time actually that uh Jess that time actually that uh Jess that time actually that uh Jess specifically was wrestling with like specifically was wrestling with like specifically was wrestling with like feeling like she was just drawn to her feeling like she was just drawn to her feeling like she was just drawn to her phone constantly. And so she went phone constantly. And so she went phone constantly. And so she went through a time where she had actually through a time where she had actually through a time where she had actually deleted off um Instagram from her phone deleted off um Instagram from her phone deleted off um Instagram from her phone >> um in that talked with our girls a lot >> um in that talked with our girls a lot >> um in that talked with our girls a lot about why she did that. It's not that about why she did that. It's not that about why she did that. It's not that this app is evil. It's not that you know this app is evil. It's not that you know this app is evil. It's not that you know that sort of a thing, but it was how it that sort of a thing, but it was how it that sort of a thing, but it was how it was making her feel. It was how it was was making her feel. It was how it was was making her feel. It was how it was drawing her into spaces she didn't want drawing her into spaces she didn't want drawing her into spaces she didn't want to go to. Um, and within maybe a year to go to. Um, and within maybe a year to go to. Um, and within maybe a year later, we were going into the summer, later, we were going into the summer, later, we were going into the summer, maybe two years later. Um, we're going maybe two years later. Um, we're going maybe two years later. Um, we're going into the summer, our oldest daughter into the summer, our oldest daughter into the summer, our oldest daughter comes to us and she says, "Mom, dad, I I comes to us and she says, "Mom, dad, I I comes to us and she says, "Mom, dad, I I think I'm going to delete in Instagram think I'm going to delete in Instagram think I'm going to delete in Instagram off my phone." Okay. So, tell us why.

off my phone." Okay. So, tell us why. off my phone." Okay. So, tell us why. Why are you I don't really I I've just Why are you I don't really I I've just Why are you I don't really I I've just been noticing how it's been making me been noticing how it's been making me been noticing how it's been making me feel. I'm comparing myself to others a feel. I'm comparing myself to others a feel. I'm comparing myself to others a lot. I'm, you know, I'm kind of in this lot. I'm, you know, I'm kind of in this lot. I'm, you know, I'm kind of in this space and I don't want to spend my space and I don't want to spend my space and I don't want to spend my summer doing that. summer doing that. summer doing that. >> We go through the summer, it's gone. Uh >> We go through the summer, it's gone. Uh >> We go through the summer, it's gone. Uh we check in with her at the end of the we check in with her at the end of the we check in with her at the end of the summer and we say, "Tell us where you're summer and we say, "Tell us where you're summer and we say, "Tell us where you're at." She's like, "I don't miss it. I at." She's like, "I don't miss it. I at." She's like, "I don't miss it. I don't want it back." Um and she didn't don't want it back." Um and she didn't don't want it back." Um and she didn't have it. I think she did. She put it have it. I think she did. She put it have it. I think she did. She put it back on like a year later. Has handled back on like a year later. Has handled back on like a year later. Has handled that really well. But it's just really that really well. But it's just really that really well. But it's just really like self-aware in that. But where that like self-aware in that. But where that like self-aware in that. But where that all started from was her watching her all started from was her watching her all started from was her watching her mom, listening to her mom, like process mom, listening to her mom, like process mom, listening to her mom, like process that well and say, "This is where I'm that well and say, "This is where I'm that well and say, "This is where I'm actually struggling, where I'm actually struggling, where I'm actually struggling, where I'm wrestling, maybe even where I don't feel wrestling, maybe even where I don't feel wrestling, maybe even where I don't feel like I'm measuring up where I should like I'm measuring up where I should like I'm measuring up where I should be." be." be." >> And she she heard that language, was >> And she she heard that language, was >> And she she heard that language, was able to translate it into her own life, able to translate it into her own life, able to translate it into her own life, and made a decision at like 15 years old and made a decision at like 15 years old and made a decision at like 15 years old that was like far above her years. that was like far above her years. that was like far above her years. >> Yeah. And that's so hard to do, I think, >> Yeah. And that's so hard to do, I think, >> Yeah. And that's so hard to do, I think, as parents and adults because you think, as parents and adults because you think, as parents and adults because you think, I'm supposed to have it all together. I'm supposed to have it all together. I'm supposed to have it all together. I'm supposed to have all the answers. So I'm supposed to have all the answers. So I'm supposed to have all the answers. So showing weakness and vulnerability is it showing weakness and vulnerability is it showing weakness and vulnerability is it going to make my kids insecure? But what going to make my kids insecure? But what going to make my kids insecure? But what you're saying is it actually is more you're saying is it actually is more you're saying is it actually is more empowering and more connecting.

empowering and more connecting. empowering and more connecting. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Because you we we connect with people >> Because you we we connect with people >> Because you we we connect with people more more more >> out of our weaknesses than we do out of >> out of our weaknesses than we do out of >> out of our weaknesses than we do out of our strengths. our strengths. our strengths. >> Absolutely. >> Absolutely. >> Absolutely. >> It's just it's hard to reframe that. >> It's just it's hard to reframe that. >> It's just it's hard to reframe that. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> All right. So let let's pivot to >> All right. So let let's pivot to >> All right. So let let's pivot to spiritual formation. We were talking spiritual formation. We were talking spiritual formation. We were talking about this childhood of Jesus, how we about this childhood of Jesus, how we about this childhood of Jesus, how we grew in wisdom and in stature and in grew in wisdom and in stature and in grew in wisdom and in stature and in favor with God and in favor with man. favor with God and in favor with man. favor with God and in favor with man. So, you're talking about physical growth So, you're talking about physical growth So, you're talking about physical growth and emotional growth and and social and emotional growth and and social and emotional growth and and social connection, but also spiritual connection, but also spiritual connection, but also spiritual connection. And obviously, one of the connection. And obviously, one of the connection. And obviously, one of the biggest roles of a parent, a Christian biggest roles of a parent, a Christian biggest roles of a parent, a Christian parent, is how do I help impart um the parent, is how do I help impart um the parent, is how do I help impart um the love of Christ and what does it mean to love of Christ and what does it mean to love of Christ and what does it mean to be a Jesus follower into their lives, be a Jesus follower into their lives, be a Jesus follower into their lives, not by force, but by example and by not by force, but by example and by not by force, but by example and by asking good questions and by asking good questions and by asking good questions and by instruction. So, so tell us like how instruction. So, so tell us like how instruction. So, so tell us like how that happens. tell us what the research that happens. tell us what the research that happens. tell us what the research is showing us about um this generation is showing us about um this generation is showing us about um this generation that's growing up and how we can equip that's growing up and how we can equip that's growing up and how we can equip parents to to do this. Well, parents to to do this. Well, parents to to do this. Well, >> yeah, let's just start really wide lens >> yeah, let's just start really wide lens >> yeah, let's just start really wide lens and really understand even as Christian and really understand even as Christian and really understand even as Christian parents, we can sometimes lose sight of parents, we can sometimes lose sight of parents, we can sometimes lose sight of how powerful our faith is. Um and yet in how powerful our faith is. Um and yet in how powerful our faith is. Um and yet in research study after study after study research study after study after study research study after study after study after study, what we see is that young after study, what we see is that young after study, what we see is that young people who are more committed to their people who are more committed to their people who are more committed to their faith have better mental health outcomes faith have better mental health outcomes faith have better mental health outcomes and life outcomes across the board. Um, and life outcomes across the board. Um, and life outcomes across the board. Um, so one of the best like like even if we so one of the best like like even if we so one of the best like like even if we step away from Pastor Doug right now, step away from Pastor Doug right now, step away from Pastor Doug right now, right? And we're just thinking about right? And we're just thinking about right? And we're just thinking about Father Doug. That sounds like your Father Doug. That sounds like your Father Doug. That sounds like your priest, I guess. But like, you know, priest, I guess. But like, you know, priest, I guess. But like, you know, just just Doug. There you go. Doug is just just Doug. There you go. Doug is just just Doug. There you go. Doug is dad. Um, dad. Um, dad. Um, >> like there's there's nothing more >> like there's there's nothing more >> like there's there's nothing more powerful we can do for our children to powerful we can do for our children to powerful we can do for our children to to have a flourishing life than to give to have a flourishing life than to give to have a flourishing life than to give them to pass on a true and genuine faith

them to pass on a true and genuine faith them to pass on a true and genuine faith um into their life. Um, so that's that's um into their life. Um, so that's that's um into their life. Um, so that's that's just one place we like to start with just one place we like to start with just one place we like to start with with parents is to understand like like with parents is to understand like like with parents is to understand like like this is so important. We have lots of this is so important. We have lots of this is so important. We have lots of goals for our kids and we live in a goals for our kids and we live in a goals for our kids and we live in a world that can be anti- those goals world that can be anti- those goals world that can be anti- those goals sometimes. Um, but that's that should be sometimes. Um, but that's that should be sometimes. Um, but that's that should be our number one goal. our number one goal. our number one goal. >> Yeah. And so I think um in in our work >> Yeah. And so I think um in in our work >> Yeah. And so I think um in in our work in in the study that we do with Next in in the study that we do with Next in in the study that we do with Next Generation and with parents uh we looked Generation and with parents uh we looked Generation and with parents uh we looked at we're like man we know that faith is at we're like man we know that faith is at we're like man we know that faith is so important. So like how exactly is it so important. So like how exactly is it so important. So like how exactly is it passed down? It is if how is it passed down? It is if how is it passed down? It is if how is it successful? Like what does that look successful? Like what does that look successful? Like what does that look like? What should it look like? Um and like? What should it look like? Um and like? What should it look like? Um and so again, one of the the maybe key so again, one of the the maybe key so again, one of the the maybe key markers, the places that we like to markers, the places that we like to markers, the places that we like to start is just to remind parents that start is just to remind parents that start is just to remind parents that like research those. So we asked Gen Z, like research those. So we asked Gen Z, like research those. So we asked Gen Z, we asked Gen Alpha, like who is your we asked Gen Alpha, like who is your we asked Gen Alpha, like who is your number one influence? And we gave them number one influence? And we gave them number one influence? And we gave them choices and you would think like man choices and you would think like man choices and you would think like man friends or social media or I mean you friends or social media or I mean you friends or social media or I mean you name it, right? and and time and time name it, right? and and time and time name it, right? and and time and time again, like not even close, they picked again, like not even close, they picked again, like not even close, they picked parents. And so even in parents. And so even in parents. And so even in >> even as old as those 17 to 19 year olds >> even as old as those 17 to 19 year olds >> even as old as those 17 to 19 year olds in the top, you know, uh levels of our in the top, you know, uh levels of our in the top, you know, uh levels of our >> So they picked you, but they won't tell >> So they picked you, but they won't tell >> So they picked you, but they won't tell you that.

you that. you that. >> Yeah. Exactly. >> Yeah. Exactly. >> Yeah. Exactly. >> Yes. And so and so I just made it my >> Yes. And so and so I just made it my >> Yes. And so and so I just made it my mission. I'm like everywhere I go, I mission. I'm like everywhere I go, I mission. I'm like everywhere I go, I just want to tell parents like you are just want to tell parents like you are just want to tell parents like you are still the number one influence. You still the number one influence. You still the number one influence. You don't have to um necessarily like regain don't have to um necessarily like regain don't have to um necessarily like regain your influence. Like you have it, you your influence. Like you have it, you your influence. Like you have it, you need to be intentional with it, but you need to be intentional with it, but you need to be intentional with it, but you have this influence, which is so have this influence, which is so have this influence, which is so beautiful to me. Um, but I remember we beautiful to me. Um, but I remember we beautiful to me. Um, but I remember we were uh presenting to to a group of were uh presenting to to a group of were uh presenting to to a group of parents and afterwards, God bless this parents and afterwards, God bless this parents and afterwards, God bless this poor mom, came up to me and she it poor mom, came up to me and she it poor mom, came up to me and she it literally looked like I had just like literally looked like I had just like literally looked like I had just like set a boulder on her shoulders and she set a boulder on her shoulders and she set a boulder on her shoulders and she goes, "What am I supposed to do with goes, "What am I supposed to do with goes, "What am I supposed to do with that?" And I was like, "Oh no, I'm so that?" And I was like, "Oh no, I'm so that?" And I was like, "Oh no, I'm so sorry." And so I had a great sorry." And so I had a great sorry." And so I had a great conversation with her, but just conversation with her, but just conversation with her, but just understanding that that can feel uh like understanding that that can feel uh like understanding that that can feel uh like a huge like a huge boulder, a huge a huge like a huge boulder, a huge a huge like a huge boulder, a huge burden, like man, I have this influence. burden, like man, I have this influence. burden, like man, I have this influence. I don't know what I'm supposed to do I don't know what I'm supposed to do I don't know what I'm supposed to do with it. So we continued with our with it. So we continued with our with it. So we continued with our research um and we came across one of research um and we came across one of research um and we came across one of our favorite studies uh which is done our favorite studies uh which is done our favorite studies uh which is done out of the University of Southern out of the University of Southern out of the University of Southern California Vernon Bangston. Do you want California Vernon Bangston. Do you want California Vernon Bangston. Do you want to tell us about the study? to tell us about the study? to tell us about the study? >> Yeah, so as research nerds it it's like >> Yeah, so as research nerds it it's like >> Yeah, so as research nerds it it's like a beautiful study because it's done over a beautiful study because it's done over a beautiful study because it's done over four generations of the same family. So four generations of the same family. So four generations of the same family. So that's incredible just to have that kind that's incredible just to have that kind that's incredible just to have that kind of access. Um it's uh I think 3,500 of access. Um it's uh I think 3,500 of access. Um it's uh I think 3,500 participants done over 35 years. Um so I participants done over 35 years. Um so I participants done over 35 years. Um so I mean this is like research gold. uh this mean this is like research gold. uh this mean this is like research gold. uh this is an expensive study you know to to put is an expensive study you know to to put is an expensive study you know to to put together together together >> to follow all those people all those >> to follow all those people all those >> to follow all those people all those times times times >> but in that so basically what they did >> but in that so basically what they did >> but in that so basically what they did is they were measuring like what what do is they were measuring like what what do is they were measuring like what what do those families look like that pass on those families look like that pass on those families look like that pass on their faith to the next generation their faith to the next generation their faith to the next generation >> or they're non-faith so interestingly >> or they're non-faith so interestingly >> or they're non-faith so interestingly enough I mean it followed families who enough I mean it followed families who enough I mean it followed families who were atheists families who were of were atheists families who were of were atheists families who were of different religions like what does that different religions like what does that different religions like what does that process look like and what are there any

process look like and what are there any process look like and what are there any key components that we would say like key components that we would say like key components that we would say like families who do this or parents who do families who do this or parents who do families who do this or parents who do this are more successful in passing on this are more successful in passing on this are more successful in passing on faith which again is so important And faith which again is so important And faith which again is so important And what they found was they just identified what they found was they just identified what they found was they just identified as closeness. So as um as young adult as closeness. So as um as young adult as closeness. So as um as young adult children identified in their family that children identified in their family that children identified in their family that there was a closeness in that family, there was a closeness in that family, there was a closeness in that family, they were as much as twice as likely to they were as much as twice as likely to they were as much as twice as likely to carry on their faith into their young carry on their faith into their young carry on their faith into their young adult and then adult years. adult and then adult years. adult and then adult years. >> But I was not happy with closeness. >> But I was not happy with closeness. >> But I was not happy with closeness. >> Yeah. We're like what does that mean? >> Yeah. We're like what does that mean? >> Yeah. We're like what does that mean? >> Like it's so ambiguous. Right. So what >> Like it's so ambiguous. Right. So what >> Like it's so ambiguous. Right. So what is closeness? So as we dug into the is closeness? So as we dug into the is closeness? So as we dug into the study uh there were three components of study uh there were three components of study uh there were three components of that closeness uh that we have cutely that closeness uh that we have cutely that closeness uh that we have cutely named. So we call them warmth, wonder named. So we call them warmth, wonder named. So we call them warmth, wonder and walk. So I think it was uh it is and walk. So I think it was uh it is and walk. So I think it was uh it is warmth and it is like relationship warmth and it is like relationship warmth and it is like relationship >> open conversations and it's modeling. So >> open conversations and it's modeling. So >> open conversations and it's modeling. So we'll we'll unpack each of those but we we'll we'll unpack each of those but we we'll we'll unpack each of those but we just like uh for the sake of ease of just like uh for the sake of ease of just like uh for the sake of ease of remembering and for parents to say man remembering and for parents to say man remembering and for parents to say man it's warmth, wonder and walk. it's warmth, wonder and walk. it's warmth, wonder and walk. >> So let's start with warmth. Thinking >> So let's start with warmth. Thinking >> So let's start with warmth. Thinking about that um warmth first of all warmth about that um warmth first of all warmth about that um warmth first of all warmth envelops this whole thing. So without envelops this whole thing. So without envelops this whole thing. So without warmth um your wonder and your walk have warmth um your wonder and your walk have warmth um your wonder and your walk have less impact. So there has to be a warmth less impact. So there has to be a warmth less impact. So there has to be a warmth in that relationship. This really comes in that relationship. This really comes in that relationship. This really comes back to that security piece we were back to that security piece we were back to that security piece we were talking earlier talking earlier talking earlier >> that your home is a place where your >> that your home is a place where your >> that your home is a place where your kids want to come to. They find it to be kids want to come to. They find it to be kids want to come to. They find it to be a safe haven.

a safe haven. a safe haven. >> Um we say with our girls that our goal >> Um we say with our girls that our goal >> Um we say with our girls that our goal is that someday when they don't have to is that someday when they don't have to is that someday when they don't have to spend time with us, they'll want to spend time with us, they'll want to spend time with us, they'll want to spend time with us. spend time with us. spend time with us. >> Um we'll see. We're not there yet, but >> Um we'll see. We're not there yet, but >> Um we'll see. We're not there yet, but we we hope so. we we hope so. we we hope so. >> Um >> Um >> Um >> but so so building that warm space. Um >> but so so building that warm space. Um >> but so so building that warm space. Um >> and not permissive. This is not best >> and not permissive. This is not best >> and not permissive. This is not best friend parenting, right? So there are friend parenting, right? So there are friend parenting, right? So there are still boundaries. there are still those still boundaries. there are still those still boundaries. there are still those uh guard rails in place, but really uh guard rails in place, but really uh guard rails in place, but really there is this warmth piece there is this warmth piece there is this warmth piece >> um that that is so so important. And we >> um that that is so so important. And we >> um that that is so so important. And we saw in the study, man, parents who saw in the study, man, parents who saw in the study, man, parents who really uh had what I would say like they really uh had what I would say like they really uh had what I would say like they had it all together, man, their kids had it all together, man, their kids had it all together, man, their kids were like in the Bible and they attended were like in the Bible and they attended were like in the Bible and they attended church and they did all the things, but church and they did all the things, but church and they did all the things, but I remember in one lacking warmth. Yeah. I remember in one lacking warmth. Yeah. I remember in one lacking warmth. Yeah. the one he lacked warmth and he just the one he lacked warmth and he just the one he lacked warmth and he just talked about uh he said his dad didn't talked about uh he said his dad didn't talked about uh he said his dad didn't feel like he wanted to be around him feel like he wanted to be around him feel like he wanted to be around him >> and and because of that that's what he >> and and because of that that's what he >> and and because of that that's what he identified as like he does not follow identified as like he does not follow identified as like he does not follow the faith of his parents like it wasn't the faith of his parents like it wasn't the faith of his parents like it wasn't attractive it wasn't attractive it wasn't attractive it wasn't >> wasn't compelling yeah why would I want >> wasn't compelling yeah why would I want >> wasn't compelling yeah why would I want to follow to follow to follow >> yeah it's funny because I I had a a a >> yeah it's funny because I I had a a a >> yeah it's funny because I I had a a a kid I went to high school with and his kid I went to high school with and his kid I went to high school with and his parents were super strict and they were parents were super strict and they were parents were super strict and they were always in church and they followed all always in church and they followed all always in church and they followed all the rules and the rules and the rules and >> and like when he got out of high school >> and like when he got out of high school >> and like when he got out of high school he went to college and never came back he went to college and never came back he went to college and never came back like just and and I think it was because like just and and I think it was because like just and and I think it was because the family was either too perfect or the family was either too perfect or the family was either too perfect or they expected him to be too perfect.

they expected him to be too perfect. they expected him to be too perfect. >> Sure. >> Sure. >> Sure. >> Or he couldn't talk about what he was >> Or he couldn't talk about what he was >> Or he couldn't talk about what he was really thinking and feeling. really thinking and feeling. really thinking and feeling. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> And it it sort of was like a almost like >> And it it sort of was like a almost like >> And it it sort of was like a almost like a a a >> well I don't want that because I can't >> well I don't want that because I can't >> well I don't want that because I can't be myself here. I can't ask questions. be myself here. I can't ask questions. be myself here. I can't ask questions. Yeah. So So give you I'll give you a Yeah. So So give you I'll give you a Yeah. So So give you I'll give you a scenario. Let's say your your kid comes scenario. Let's say your your kid comes scenario. Let's say your your kid comes home and they they're there's a home and they they're there's a home and they they're there's a situation at school with drugs or all situation at school with drugs or all situation at school with drugs or all these things and and they tell you as these things and and they tell you as these things and and they tell you as parents and then you freak out. What parents and then you freak out. What parents and then you freak out. What what what does that communicate? like what what does that communicate? like what what does that communicate? like talk about that scenario because that talk about that scenario because that talk about that scenario because that that's a typical scenario where parents that's a typical scenario where parents that's a typical scenario where parents get get get >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, we'll even call >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, we'll even call >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, we'll even call that like there there's either a that like there there's either a that like there there's either a conversation opener or a conversation conversation opener or a conversation conversation opener or a conversation blocker, right? And that's a blocker, blocker, right? And that's a blocker, blocker, right? And that's a blocker, right? Because because if we freak out, right? Because because if we freak out, right? Because because if we freak out, we have let them know like this is not we have let them know like this is not we have let them know like this is not safe here to talk about. safe here to talk about. safe here to talk about. >> Um I'm in trouble because I talked about >> Um I'm in trouble because I talked about >> Um I'm in trouble because I talked about that. that. that. >> Um and so >> Um and so >> Um and so >> and that means they're going to take >> and that means they're going to take >> and that means they're going to take that conversation that conversation that conversation >> somewhere else. >> somewhere else. >> somewhere else. >> Exactly. It's it's going to happen. just >> Exactly. It's it's going to happen. just >> Exactly. It's it's going to happen. just whether you're the safe place to have whether you're the safe place to have whether you're the safe place to have that conversation or not. Yeah. that conversation or not. Yeah. that conversation or not. Yeah. >> See, I remember hearing that someone was >> See, I remember hearing that someone was >> See, I remember hearing that someone was talking about this maybe when my kids talking about this maybe when my kids talking about this maybe when my kids were young teenagers and they're like if were young teenagers and they're like if were young teenagers and they're like if there's any conversation that you can't there's any conversation that you can't there's any conversation that you can't handle as a parent, your kids will sense handle as a parent, your kids will sense handle as a parent, your kids will sense it and go elsewhere. Yeah. And I was it and go elsewhere. Yeah. And I was it and go elsewhere. Yeah. And I was like conversation I can't handle, you like conversation I can't handle, you like conversation I can't handle, you know, like and it sort of flipped the know, like and it sort of flipped the know, like and it sort of flipped the script on me that if I get so angry or script on me that if I get so angry or script on me that if I get so angry or so like freaked out that they'll so like freaked out that they'll so like freaked out that they'll conclude this is not safe to talk to dad conclude this is not safe to talk to dad conclude this is not safe to talk to dad about.

about. about. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> And that that was a very eye opening >> And that that was a very eye opening >> And that that was a very eye opening conversation. So, it's like remain calm, conversation. So, it's like remain calm, conversation. So, it's like remain calm, ask questions. My wife has, you know, ask questions. My wife has, you know, ask questions. My wife has, you know, she she she's the same way. She she'll she she she's the same way. She she'll she she she's the same way. She she'll say it and then think it at the same say it and then think it at the same say it and then think it at the same time. And and and so she learned to go time. And and and so she learned to go time. And and and so she learned to go right when she's about to pounce on right when she's about to pounce on right when she's about to pounce on something because they're telling her something because they're telling her something because they're telling her stuff that that's not good. stuff that that's not good. stuff that that's not good. >> She learned to like pause for another >> She learned to like pause for another >> She learned to like pause for another second and then they would tell what second and then they would tell what second and then they would tell what they really thought about it. And it was they really thought about it. And it was they really thought about it. And it was that one second pause that created that one second pause that created that one second pause that created warmth. warmth. warmth. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Where you don't follow your first >> Where you don't follow your first >> Where you don't follow your first protective nature. protective nature. protective nature. >> Yeah. And >> Yeah. And >> Yeah. And >> I I that was one of my prayers. >> I I that was one of my prayers. >> I I that was one of my prayers. >> Take a breath. Yeah. >> Take a breath. Yeah. >> Take a breath. Yeah. >> Yeah. Pray for the pods. Pray for pause. >> Yeah. Pray for the pods. Pray for pause. >> Yeah. Pray for the pods. Pray for pause. Lord, give me pause. Give me pause. Lord, give me pause. Give me pause. Lord, give me pause. Give me pause. >> Trust the pause. >> Trust the pause. >> Trust the pause. >> Yeah, that's good. >> Yeah, that's good. >> Yeah, that's good. >> Good. >> Good. >> Good. >> Okay. So, after warmth. >> Okay. So, after warmth. >> Okay. So, after warmth. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Well, and you set this up perfectly >> Well, and you set this up perfectly >> Well, and you set this up perfectly because the next one is like because the next one is like because the next one is like conversation. So, wonder. So, inviting conversation. So, wonder. So, inviting conversation. So, wonder. So, inviting them into the conversation. Um, so one them into the conversation. Um, so one them into the conversation. Um, so one of my favorite like theologians who's of my favorite like theologians who's of my favorite like theologians who's who's helped shape this is is an Old who's helped shape this is is an Old who's helped shape this is is an Old Testament theologian, Walter Bugamman. Testament theologian, Walter Bugamman. Testament theologian, Walter Bugamman. He uh has a book that that looks at uh He uh has a book that that looks at uh He uh has a book that that looks at uh Israel's history, but then specifically Israel's history, but then specifically Israel's history, but then specifically like how Israel formed the next like how Israel formed the next like how Israel formed the next generation and how intentional they were generation and how intentional they were generation and how intentional they were in that space. Uh we were talk talking in that space. Uh we were talk talking in that space. Uh we were talk talking about this in the car on the way here.

about this in the car on the way here. about this in the car on the way here. Um how he he he points out that Israel's Um how he he he points out that Israel's Um how he he he points out that Israel's mode of education was to invite uh the mode of education was to invite uh the mode of education was to invite uh the next generation into the mystery of God. next generation into the mystery of God. next generation into the mystery of God. >> So the expectation was they would tell >> So the expectation was they would tell >> So the expectation was they would tell the story. So we see this going all the the story. So we see this going all the the story. So we see this going all the way back to Exodus 12. Tell the story of way back to Exodus 12. Tell the story of way back to Exodus 12. Tell the story of the um of the the Passover. We see that the um of the the Passover. We see that the um of the the Passover. We see that come up in Deuteronomy 6 again, Joshua come up in Deuteronomy 6 again, Joshua come up in Deuteronomy 6 again, Joshua 4, all throughout the Psalms. When your 4, all throughout the Psalms. When your 4, all throughout the Psalms. When your children ask, tell them. So the children ask, tell them. So the children ask, tell them. So the anticipation is that your children anticipation is that your children anticipation is that your children should be interested enough to ask. So should be interested enough to ask. So should be interested enough to ask. So you should be inviting them into a you should be inviting them into a you should be inviting them into a mystery, not the answer, but a mystery mystery, not the answer, but a mystery mystery, not the answer, but a mystery that says there's more to know about that says there's more to know about that says there's more to know about this. And when they ask, you enter into this. And when they ask, you enter into this. And when they ask, you enter into that conversation with them. In that that conversation with them. In that that conversation with them. In that case, you tell them the story of how God case, you tell them the story of how God case, you tell them the story of how God rescued Israel from slavery in Egypt and rescued Israel from slavery in Egypt and rescued Israel from slavery in Egypt and what he did to to make that happen. Um, what he did to to make that happen. Um, what he did to to make that happen. Um, so that's like the conversation piece of so that's like the conversation piece of so that's like the conversation piece of it is is that so often and and we know it is is that so often and and we know it is is that so often and and we know this as as parents when our kids come to this as as parents when our kids come to this as as parents when our kids come to us and they have a question about their us and they have a question about their us and they have a question about their faith. Uh, now we're different because faith. Uh, now we're different because faith. Uh, now we're different because we love that space, right? Like we we we love that space, right? Like we we we love that space, right? Like we we enter into that, but we know a lot of enter into that, but we know a lot of enter into that, but we know a lot of parents that's intimidating too. And parents that's intimidating too. And parents that's intimidating too. And especially if they have a doubt, that's especially if they have a doubt, that's especially if they have a doubt, that's that's not just intimidating, that's that's not just intimidating, that's that's not just intimidating, that's threatening, right? That feels like you threatening, right? That feels like you threatening, right? That feels like you can't doubt your faith. You can't have can't doubt your faith. You can't have can't doubt your faith. You can't have doubts. But yet that's actually the doubts. But yet that's actually the doubts. But yet that's actually the mystery of God and we should go, mystery of God and we should go, mystery of God and we should go, >> I'm really glad you asked that question.

>> I'm really glad you asked that question. >> I'm really glad you asked that question. Or that should make us curious. I know a Or that should make us curious. I know a Or that should make us curious. I know a pastor who says that, right? That that pastor who says that, right? That that pastor who says that, right? That that should make us that should make us should make us that should make us should make us that should make us curious when we do that. curious when we do that. curious when we do that. >> So like when you're you're the pastor >> So like when you're you're the pastor >> So like when you're you're the pastor and your 10-year-old son goes into and your 10-year-old son goes into and your 10-year-old son goes into Sunday school and says, "I don't believe Sunday school and says, "I don't believe Sunday school and says, "I don't believe in God." We shouldn't be freaked out by in God." We shouldn't be freaked out by in God." We shouldn't be freaked out by that. that. that. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Sounds like a >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Sounds like a >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Sounds like a story to me. story to me. story to me. >> Let's talk about that. Someone I know >> Let's talk about that. Someone I know >> Let's talk about that. Someone I know that happened to that happened to that happened to >> Yeah. It provides you can either say >> Yeah. It provides you can either say >> Yeah. It provides you can either say like, "What's wrong with you? we didn't like, "What's wrong with you? we didn't like, "What's wrong with you? we didn't raise you that way or I could say tell raise you that way or I could say tell raise you that way or I could say tell me more about that and you get you get me more about that and you get you get me more about that and you get you get the the the question behind the question the the the question behind the question the the the question behind the question which is really good but that takes a which is really good but that takes a which is really good but that takes a lot of pausing praying lot of pausing praying lot of pausing praying >> saying you know it's okay so I guess >> saying you know it's okay so I guess >> saying you know it's okay so I guess here's my question how do how do we as here's my question how do how do we as here's my question how do how do we as parents model wonder parents model wonder parents model wonder >> how do we model it for our kids because >> how do we model it for our kids because >> how do we model it for our kids because my my kids will always say like mom dad my my kids will always say like mom dad my my kids will always say like mom dad you have all the answers you've been you have all the answers you've been you have all the answers you've been Christians a long time or you you seem Christians a long time or you you seem Christians a long time or you you seem to know how to pay the bills and and pay to know how to pay the bills and and pay to know how to pay the bills and and pay the mortgage and do all the things and I the mortgage and do all the things and I the mortgage and do all the things and I I don't So, like how do you how do you I don't So, like how do you how do you I don't So, like how do you how do you model that? model that? model that? >> So, that's that's so good. So, actually >> So, that's that's so good. So, actually >> So, that's that's so good. So, actually I have a story last literally last week. I have a story last literally last week. I have a story last literally last week. Um, so I was reading in 1 Samuel um and Um, so I was reading in 1 Samuel um and Um, so I was reading in 1 Samuel um and I've I've read the story before, but it I've I've read the story before, but it I've I've read the story before, but it really struck me. It was when um the really struck me. It was when um the really struck me. It was when um the Holy Spirit left Saul and it said that Holy Spirit left Saul and it said that Holy Spirit left Saul and it said that the Lord sent an evil spirit to Saul.

the Lord sent an evil spirit to Saul. the Lord sent an evil spirit to Saul. And I just was like, I mean, that does And I just was like, I mean, that does And I just was like, I mean, that does not track with the God that I know, not track with the God that I know, not track with the God that I know, right? So, that made me wonder. And so I right? So, that made me wonder. And so I right? So, that made me wonder. And so I I did what I do and I I went to some I did what I do and I I went to some I did what I do and I I went to some commentaries and I I always go to Bible commentaries and I I always go to Bible commentaries and I I always go to Bible Project is such a great resource. Um and Project is such a great resource. Um and Project is such a great resource. Um and so was able to understand that that was so was able to understand that that was so was able to understand that that was more of God allowing an evil spirit. It more of God allowing an evil spirit. It more of God allowing an evil spirit. It wasn't sent. It was just like the the wasn't sent. It was just like the the wasn't sent. It was just like the the wording of it. Um so but what I did wording of it. Um so but what I did wording of it. Um so but what I did actually is later uh that night I'm actually is later uh that night I'm actually is later uh that night I'm getting ready for dinner. Girls are in getting ready for dinner. Girls are in getting ready for dinner. Girls are in the kitchen, right? I'm preparing and I the kitchen, right? I'm preparing and I the kitchen, right? I'm preparing and I just told them which they were not just told them which they were not just told them which they were not interested at all by the way. So I just interested at all by the way. So I just interested at all by the way. So I just I tell parents all the time, your kids I tell parents all the time, your kids I tell parents all the time, your kids do not have to respond to the do not have to respond to the do not have to respond to the conversation, but you are modeling that conversation, but you are modeling that conversation, but you are modeling that you are first of all willing to have it. you are first of all willing to have it. you are first of all willing to have it. This is a space where we talk about it. This is a space where we talk about it. This is a space where we talk about it. So I just said I was like, So I just said I was like, So I just said I was like, >> "Girls, guess what? I was reading in >> "Girls, guess what? I was reading in >> "Girls, guess what? I was reading in First Samuel today and here is what I First Samuel today and here is what I First Samuel today and here is what I read." And wasn't that so weird? And so read." And wasn't that so weird? And so read." And wasn't that so weird? And so here's what I did. And I just tracked it here's what I did. And I just tracked it here's what I did. And I just tracked it all through and here's what I all through and here's what I all through and here's what I discovered. And they were like, discovered. And they were like, discovered. And they were like, >> "Okay, thanks mom. What's dinner? >> "Okay, thanks mom. What's dinner? >> "Okay, thanks mom. What's dinner? Dinner's going to be ready." Right? But Dinner's going to be ready." Right? But Dinner's going to be ready." Right? But I know that first of all, parenting is a I know that first of all, parenting is a I know that first of all, parenting is a long game, right? So, I'm not expecting long game, right? So, I'm not expecting long game, right? So, I'm not expecting them to be like, "Wow, mom, that was them to be like, "Wow, mom, that was them to be like, "Wow, mom, that was amazing. Tell me more." Like, that's amazing. Tell me more." Like, that's amazing. Tell me more." Like, that's that's not going to happen. But what my that's not going to happen. But what my that's not going to happen. But what my prayer is, what my hope is, is that that prayer is, what my hope is, is that that prayer is, what my hope is, is that that modeling piece that I'm showing them.

modeling piece that I'm showing them. modeling piece that I'm showing them. >> But first of all, I'm still learning. >> But first of all, I'm still learning. >> But first of all, I'm still learning. Like, there are things and questions I Like, there are things and questions I Like, there are things and questions I have about the Bible. Um, but that's have about the Bible. Um, but that's have about the Bible. Um, but that's actually a beautiful thing that we get actually a beautiful thing that we get actually a beautiful thing that we get to be invited. Like, man, we serve a God to be invited. Like, man, we serve a God to be invited. Like, man, we serve a God that we are never fully going to that we are never fully going to that we are never fully going to understand. And it's so great when you understand. And it's so great when you understand. And it's so great when you have questions or when there's something have questions or when there's something have questions or when there's something that is troubling you like you read a that is troubling you like you read a that is troubling you like you read a passage of scripture and you're like I passage of scripture and you're like I passage of scripture and you're like I don't understand that or that doesn't don't understand that or that doesn't don't understand that or that doesn't sit right or then that's an invitation sit right or then that's an invitation sit right or then that's an invitation to learn more. And so again modeling I to learn more. And so again modeling I to learn more. And so again modeling I mean there is many times where our girls mean there is many times where our girls mean there is many times where our girls um have asked us things in the Bible um have asked us things in the Bible um have asked us things in the Bible about you know it tends to be the Old about you know it tends to be the Old about you know it tends to be the Old Testament. It just does but the Testament. It just does but the Testament. It just does but the character of God and I don't understand character of God and I don't understand character of God and I don't understand and and how and so then we walk with and and how and so then we walk with and and how and so then we walk with them and like that's a great question. them and like that's a great question. them and like that's a great question. Let's let's look at that together. Um Let's let's look at that together. Um Let's let's look at that together. Um and so that's what we encourage parents. and so that's what we encourage parents. and so that's what we encourage parents. I mean, I mean, I mean, >> you you do not have to know the answer, >> you you do not have to know the answer, >> you you do not have to know the answer, but can you model that process of like, but can you model that process of like, but can you model that process of like, man, I don't know. What a great man, I don't know. What a great man, I don't know. What a great question. I'm so glad that you're question. I'm so glad that you're question. I'm so glad that you're thinking about that. Let's go find out thinking about that. Let's go find out thinking about that. Let's go find out together. And we have great pastors at together. And we have great pastors at together. And we have great pastors at our church who would love to come our church who would love to come our church who would love to come alongside parents. I mean, we've got alongside parents. I mean, we've got alongside parents. I mean, we've got such great great pastors in our NextGen such great great pastors in our NextGen such great great pastors in our NextGen ministry who can come alongside and ministry who can come alongside and ministry who can come alongside and provide resources. And again, you're provide resources. And again, you're provide resources. And again, you're modeling that that's a forever that's modeling that that's a forever that's modeling that that's a forever that's like a lifelong process. Like, I'm never like a lifelong process. Like, I'm never like a lifelong process. Like, I'm never going to get to a place where I going to get to a place where I going to get to a place where I understand all the things. Yeah.

understand all the things. Yeah. understand all the things. Yeah. >> So, how do we how do we model that? >> So, how do we how do we model that? >> So, how do we how do we model that? >> And I just want to drive that last point >> And I just want to drive that last point >> And I just want to drive that last point home that like it's okay if you don't home that like it's okay if you don't home that like it's okay if you don't know where to go to get those answers. know where to go to get those answers. know where to go to get those answers. That's why you're a part of a church, That's why you're a part of a church, That's why you're a part of a church, right? Like like you can go to pastors, right? Like like you can go to pastors, right? Like like you can go to pastors, you can go to small group leaders, like you can go to small group leaders, like you can go to small group leaders, like they can help guiding in that cuz they can help guiding in that cuz they can help guiding in that cuz >> um yeah, that that can be really >> um yeah, that that can be really >> um yeah, that that can be really intimidating because intimidating because intimidating because >> like we know not all parents are are >> like we know not all parents are are >> like we know not all parents are are like comfortable like answering some of like comfortable like answering some of like comfortable like answering some of those questions. They're they're growing those questions. They're they're growing those questions. They're they're growing in their own faith. Mhm. in their own faith. Mhm. in their own faith. Mhm. >> Um but if they can just be willing to >> Um but if they can just be willing to >> Um but if they can just be willing to hear the question, um live with the hear the question, um live with the hear the question, um live with the doubt even and say, you know, that's a doubt even and say, you know, that's a doubt even and say, you know, that's a really good question actually. I'd love really good question actually. I'd love really good question actually. I'd love to like look at this more together. to like look at this more together. to like look at this more together. Let's do that. Let's do that. Let's do that. >> I don't know, but I'll find out or we'll >> I don't know, but I'll find out or we'll >> I don't know, but I'll find out or we'll figure this out together. figure this out together. figure this out together. >> Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. >> All right. So, we we have this idea of >> All right. So, we we have this idea of >> All right. So, we we have this idea of wonder that leads to walk. So, tell me wonder that leads to walk. So, tell me wonder that leads to walk. So, tell me about walk. about walk. about walk. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> And you and again a beautiful segue. We >> And you and again a beautiful segue. We >> And you and again a beautiful segue. We were just talking about modeling that were just talking about modeling that were just talking about modeling that and really that is what walk is is that and really that is what walk is is that and really that is what walk is is that you are modeling uh what it looks like you are modeling uh what it looks like you are modeling uh what it looks like to live out your faith in that Monday to live out your faith in that Monday to live out your faith in that Monday through Friday, Monday through Saturday through Friday, Monday through Saturday through Friday, Monday through Saturday space, right? What does it look like for space, right? What does it look like for space, right? What does it look like for me to be a mom who works full-time and me to be a mom who works full-time and me to be a mom who works full-time and has all like what does it look like for has all like what does it look like for has all like what does it look like for me to like walk that out in front of my me to like walk that out in front of my me to like walk that out in front of my kids? Uh because we know that they are kids? Uh because we know that they are kids? Uh because we know that they are going to do what they see more than going to do what they see more than going to do what they see more than they're going to, you know, do what they're going to, you know, do what they're going to, you know, do what they're told. Um and so we have this they're told. Um and so we have this they're told. Um and so we have this amazing uh research stat that we like to amazing uh research stat that we like to amazing uh research stat that we like to pull, the one stat that we'll share. Um, pull, the one stat that we'll share. Um, pull, the one stat that we'll share. Um, and I'll let you share it because I I and I'll let you share it because I I and I'll let you share it because I I mess it up often. But mess it up often. But mess it up often. But >> yeah, so this is our research with Gen >> yeah, so this is our research with Gen >> yeah, so this is our research with Gen Alpha that One Hope did. Uh, so these Alpha that One Hope did. Uh, so these Alpha that One Hope did. Uh, so these are 11 to 13 year olds. Uh, we asked a are 11 to 13 year olds. Uh, we asked a are 11 to 13 year olds. Uh, we asked a lot of questions around their own

lot of questions around their own lot of questions around their own spiritual um, practices. So do they read spiritual um, practices. So do they read spiritual um, practices. So do they read the Bible? Do they pray? Do they uh, you the Bible? Do they pray? Do they uh, you the Bible? Do they pray? Do they uh, you know, share their faith with others, but know, share their faith with others, but know, share their faith with others, but then we also asked questions about what then we also asked questions about what then we also asked questions about what their parents parents do and what they their parents parents do and what they their parents parents do and what they see their parents doing. Um, so let's see their parents doing. Um, so let's see their parents doing. Um, so let's just look at Bible reading as an just look at Bible reading as an just look at Bible reading as an example. Uh when we saw that young example. Uh when we saw that young example. Uh when we saw that young people their their parents read the people their their parents read the people their their parents read the Bible with them, they were almost seven Bible with them, they were almost seven Bible with them, they were almost seven times more likely to read the Bible on times more likely to read the Bible on times more likely to read the Bible on their own at least weekly. their own at least weekly. their own at least weekly. >> But even if they just saw their parents >> But even if they just saw their parents >> But even if they just saw their parents reading, so this isn't like nightly reading, so this isn't like nightly reading, so this isn't like nightly devotion time as a family. But even if devotion time as a family. But even if devotion time as a family. But even if they just see you reading your Bible at they just see you reading your Bible at they just see you reading your Bible at the kitchen table in the morning, the kitchen table in the morning, the kitchen table in the morning, >> they're five times more likely to read >> they're five times more likely to read >> they're five times more likely to read the Bible on their own, at least weekly. the Bible on their own, at least weekly. the Bible on their own, at least weekly. >> We just tell parents, just get caught >> We just tell parents, just get caught >> We just tell parents, just get caught reading your Bible. reading your Bible. reading your Bible. >> Exactly. That's a great line. Get caught >> Exactly. That's a great line. Get caught >> Exactly. That's a great line. Get caught reading your Bible. reading your Bible. reading your Bible. >> It's so powerful. And so actually funny >> It's so powerful. And so actually funny >> It's so powerful. And so actually funny enough when this research you know the enough when this research you know the enough when this research you know the the raw data is coming out and we're the raw data is coming out and we're the raw data is coming out and we're looking at this and we're like wow that looking at this and we're like wow that looking at this and we're like wow that is that is incredible. is that is incredible. is that is incredible. >> Yeah because that doesn't take a >> Yeah because that doesn't take a >> Yeah because that doesn't take a researcher to understand the researcher to understand the researcher to understand the significance of the same right and so I significance of the same right and so I significance of the same right and so I mean we I mean again we have uh been in mean we I mean again we have uh been in mean we I mean again we have uh been in ministry and we love God's we work for a ministry and we love God's we work for a ministry and we love God's we work for a missions organization right so we love missions organization right so we love missions organization right so we love God's word um but we we looked at that God's word um but we we looked at that God's word um but we we looked at that stat and we're like that's really stat and we're like that's really stat and we're like that's really interesting. So Barry actually um interesting. So Barry actually um interesting. So Barry actually um started he didn't have a conversation started he didn't have a conversation started he didn't have a conversation about it. He just started at breakfast.

about it. He just started at breakfast. about it. He just started at breakfast. Um he got out his Bible and just read as Um he got out his Bible and just read as Um he got out his Bible and just read as the girls were coming downstairs to get the girls were coming downstairs to get the girls were coming downstairs to get ready for school. And our daughter at ready for school. And our daughter at ready for school. And our daughter at the time, I think she was 15. Um she the time, I think she was 15. Um she the time, I think she was 15. Um she just looked at him. She goes, just looked at him. She goes, just looked at him. She goes, >> I didn't know you read your Bible. >> I didn't know you read your Bible. >> I didn't know you read your Bible. >> After >> After >> After >> I didn't know you read your Bible. >> I didn't know you read your Bible. >> I didn't know you read your Bible. That's great. That's great. That's great. That's great. That's great. That's great. >> Failure. What is happening here? But she >> Failure. What is happening here? But she >> Failure. What is happening here? But she she just never saw Yeah. She never saw she just never saw Yeah. She never saw she just never saw Yeah. She never saw it happen. And so we would just we kind it happen. And so we would just we kind it happen. And so we would just we kind of took that and we're like oh yeah we of took that and we're like oh yeah we of took that and we're like oh yeah we dad reads his bi I read my Bible you dad reads his bi I read my Bible you dad reads his bi I read my Bible you know I usually do it after they are out know I usually do it after they are out know I usually do it after they are out of the house more quiet time or of the house more quiet time or of the house more quiet time or >> but also think about as parents you >> but also think about as parents you >> but also think about as parents you usually want that quiet time right usually want that quiet time right usually want that quiet time right before the before the before the >> so you do it by private tornado comes in >> so you do it by private tornado comes in >> so you do it by private tornado comes in the morning or in the evening or the morning or in the evening or the morning or in the evening or whatever. Yeah. Yeah. whatever. Yeah. Yeah. whatever. Yeah. Yeah. >> It makes me think of my my parents. My >> It makes me think of my my parents. My >> It makes me think of my my parents. My dad read the Bible at dinner every dad read the Bible at dinner every dad read the Bible at dinner every night. Even if guests were they could night. Even if guests were they could night. Even if guests were they could have been Jewish or atheist. He didn't have been Jewish or atheist. He didn't have been Jewish or atheist. He didn't care if you're around Saturday table. care if you're around Saturday table. care if you're around Saturday table. We're reading the Bible after dinner. We're reading the Bible after dinner. We're reading the Bible after dinner. But that wasn't the most powerful But that wasn't the most powerful But that wasn't the most powerful example to me. It was when I saw him example to me. It was when I saw him example to me. It was when I saw him reading his Bible in his room. or him on reading his Bible in his room. or him on reading his Bible in his room. or him on his knees by his bed. Same thing with my his knees by his bed. Same thing with my his knees by his bed. Same thing with my mom. It was when I like, okay, that's mom. It was when I like, okay, that's mom. It was when I like, okay, that's that's real for them. that's real for them. that's real for them. >> It made a deep impression on me. Even >> It made a deep impression on me. Even >> It made a deep impression on me. Even when I didn't believe, like there's when I didn't believe, like there's when I didn't believe, like there's something very real there.

something very real there. something very real there. >> It took about a week. And again, we >> It took about a week. And again, we >> It took about a week. And again, we didn't have further conversations. We didn't have further conversations. We didn't have further conversations. We just noted that. I was like, "Okay, just noted that. I was like, "Okay, just noted that. I was like, "Okay, that's interesting. Keep doing that." that's interesting. Keep doing that." that's interesting. Keep doing that." Um, about a week later, our daughter Um, about a week later, our daughter Um, about a week later, our daughter just that morning, she comes downstairs just that morning, she comes downstairs just that morning, she comes downstairs and she grabs her Bible and just opens and she grabs her Bible and just opens and she grabs her Bible and just opens it up next to her dad and they just ate it up next to her dad and they just ate it up next to her dad and they just ate breakfast and read the Bible. What a breakfast and read the Bible. What a breakfast and read the Bible. What a great what a great great what a great great what a great >> like sitting at the kitchen, you know, >> like sitting at the kitchen, you know, >> like sitting at the kitchen, you know, trying not to scene. I was just like, trying not to scene. I was just like, trying not to scene. I was just like, "Wow, that is is so powerful just this "Wow, that is is so powerful just this "Wow, that is is so powerful just this idea of modeling." Um, and I always idea of modeling." Um, and I always idea of modeling." Um, and I always encourage parents too, like again, it's encourage parents too, like again, it's encourage parents too, like again, it's not perfect modeling because you are not not perfect modeling because you are not not perfect modeling because you are not perfect and your kids are not going to perfect and your kids are not going to perfect and your kids are not going to be perfect. be perfect. be perfect. >> In fact, it shouldn't be perfect >> In fact, it shouldn't be perfect >> In fact, it shouldn't be perfect modeling because it won't be perfect for modeling because it won't be perfect for modeling because it won't be perfect for them. them. them. >> This is why we need grace. >> This is why we need grace. >> This is why we need grace. >> I mean, this next generation is looking >> I mean, this next generation is looking >> I mean, this next generation is looking for authenticity, man. They your kids for authenticity, man. They your kids for authenticity, man. They your kids are just professional at studying you, are just professional at studying you, are just professional at studying you, right? like they know, oh, I I think right? like they know, oh, I I think right? like they know, oh, I I think mom's putting on a show when she goes to mom's putting on a show when she goes to mom's putting on a show when she goes to church versus at home there's a church versus at home there's a church versus at home there's a different mom, right? Like they know different mom, right? Like they know different mom, right? Like they know you. So then what does it look like to you. So then what does it look like to you. So then what does it look like to authentically live out that faith? Um authentically live out that faith? Um authentically live out that faith? Um and so what that points to though is and so what that points to though is and so what that points to though is like man, parents, you need to be making like man, parents, you need to be making like man, parents, you need to be making your own spiritual walk a priority.

your own spiritual walk a priority. your own spiritual walk a priority. >> Like you cannot pass on something that >> Like you cannot pass on something that >> Like you cannot pass on something that you do not have. Again, you don't have you do not have. Again, you don't have you do not have. Again, you don't have to be perfect, but are you growing in to be perfect, but are you growing in to be perfect, but are you growing in your own faith? Are you reading the your own faith? Are you reading the your own faith? Are you reading the Bible outside of church? Are you reading Bible outside of church? Are you reading Bible outside of church? Are you reading uh on your own? Are you learning? Are uh on your own? Are you learning? Are uh on your own? Are you learning? Are you growing? Um are you are you again you growing? Um are you are you again you growing? Um are you are you again sharing that with your kids? Man, this sharing that with your kids? Man, this sharing that with your kids? Man, this is what I'm learning or this is what I'm is what I'm learning or this is what I'm is what I'm learning or this is what I'm reading. Um reading. Um reading. Um >> yeah, it's so so important, man. You >> yeah, it's so so important, man. You >> yeah, it's so so important, man. You can't you can't pass on what you don't can't you can't pass on what you don't can't you can't pass on what you don't have. have. have. >> Yeah. Someone pointed out this week to >> Yeah. Someone pointed out this week to >> Yeah. Someone pointed out this week to me the question we often ask our kids on me the question we often ask our kids on me the question we often ask our kids on the way from church is what do you the way from church is what do you the way from church is what do you learn? But we almost never say what we learn? But we almost never say what we learn? But we almost never say what we learned. learned. learned. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> And so mom and dad are learning, too. >> And so mom and dad are learning, too. >> And so mom and dad are learning, too. And just that just that simple shift can And just that just that simple shift can And just that just that simple shift can help your kids go, "Oh, we're all in help your kids go, "Oh, we're all in help your kids go, "Oh, we're all in this together." this together." this together." >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> All right. I got a particular question >> All right. I got a particular question >> All right. I got a particular question that's that's important for me right now that's that's important for me right now that's that's important for me right now which is I just became a grandpa and my which is I just became a grandpa and my which is I just became a grandpa and my wife became a grandma. So tell me the wife became a grandma. So tell me the wife became a grandma. So tell me the role of grandparents like extended role of grandparents like extended role of grandparents like extended family in the in the the power of that family in the in the the power of that family in the in the the power of that speaking to life to kids and grandkids. speaking to life to kids and grandkids. speaking to life to kids and grandkids. >> Yeah. Hugely important. Yeah. In fact I >> Yeah. Hugely important. Yeah. In fact I >> Yeah. Hugely important. Yeah. In fact I mean there there's all sorts of even mean there there's all sorts of even mean there there's all sorts of even just if you look at like census data just if you look at like census data just if you look at like census data there's more and more like role of there's more and more like role of there's more and more like role of grandparents in the the raising of grandparents in the the raising of grandparents in the the raising of children like like just all of that children like like just all of that children like like just all of that increasing. Uh but in that same study increasing. Uh but in that same study increasing. Uh but in that same study where we looked at warmth, wonder and where we looked at warmth, wonder and where we looked at warmth, wonder and walk um they found that grandparents walk um they found that grandparents walk um they found that grandparents were surprisingly influential in this were surprisingly influential in this were surprisingly influential in this space.

space. space. >> This is good to know. Tell me tell me >> This is good to know. Tell me tell me >> This is good to know. Tell me tell me more. more. more. >> It was the same components actually. So >> It was the same components actually. So >> It was the same components actually. So it's it's still that that same space, it's it's still that that same space, it's it's still that that same space, but grandparents played this um like but grandparents played this um like but grandparents played this um like like wise mentor. I don't know if you like wise mentor. I don't know if you like wise mentor. I don't know if you like this word, but wise elder, you like this word, but wise elder, you like this word, but wise elder, you know, kind of a kind of a role um that know, kind of a kind of a role um that know, kind of a kind of a role um that was very supportive to you know to what was very supportive to you know to what was very supportive to you know to what the parents were doing and very very the parents were doing and very very the parents were doing and very very important. Um so in fact uh we we do uh important. Um so in fact uh we we do uh important. Um so in fact uh we we do uh different uh spaces where we're talking different uh spaces where we're talking different uh spaces where we're talking to parents and usually when we do that to parents and usually when we do that to parents and usually when we do that we will say to the churches and don't we will say to the churches and don't we will say to the churches and don't forget to invite the grandparents forget to invite the grandparents forget to invite the grandparents because they play a huge and and and a because they play a huge and and and a because they play a huge and and and a key key role. key key role. key key role. And I even think man uh just that that And I even think man uh just that that And I even think man uh just that that older generation has so much wisdom to older generation has so much wisdom to older generation has so much wisdom to offer and I know we were talking earlier offer and I know we were talking earlier offer and I know we were talking earlier about um just this mentor crisis that about um just this mentor crisis that about um just this mentor crisis that we're seeing right now just as knowledge we're seeing right now just as knowledge we're seeing right now just as knowledge becomes more and more readily available becomes more and more readily available becomes more and more readily available and it's moving so fast. So you have a and it's moving so fast. So you have a and it's moving so fast. So you have a younger generation who really they don't younger generation who really they don't younger generation who really they don't need to ask us really questions about need to ask us really questions about need to ask us really questions about like they have knowledge at their like they have knowledge at their like they have knowledge at their fingertips but they're lacking hugely in fingertips but they're lacking hugely in fingertips but they're lacking hugely in the area of wisdom and what a beautiful the area of wisdom and what a beautiful the area of wisdom and what a beautiful role that yes parents but man role that yes parents but man role that yes parents but man grandparents play such a special role in grandparents play such a special role in grandparents play such a special role in that.

that. that. >> Um but I even say like even if you could >> Um but I even say like even if you could >> Um but I even say like even if you could be a surrogate grandparent like be a surrogate grandparent like be a surrogate grandparent like >> what I know that the next generation >> what I know that the next generation >> what I know that the next generation wouldn't give to have a wise older adult wouldn't give to have a wise older adult wouldn't give to have a wise older adult to be able to come alongside them and to to be able to come alongside them and to to be able to come alongside them and to speak wisdom into their life. Um even to speak wisdom into their life. Um even to speak wisdom into their life. Um even to come alongside parents man we live come alongside parents man we live come alongside parents man we live really far away from our parents. So really far away from our parents. So really far away from our parents. So like man if there is a grandparent out like man if there is a grandparent out like man if there is a grandparent out there who wants to adopt us as I am here there who wants to adopt us as I am here there who wants to adopt us as I am here for it right just to have that role is for it right just to have that role is for it right just to have that role is so so important. so so important. so so important. >> True. >> True. >> True. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> I heard one time I think it was Dallas >> I heard one time I think it was Dallas >> I heard one time I think it was Dallas Willard he said that the soul longs for Willard he said that the soul longs for Willard he said that the soul longs for a father a father a father >> or a soul that that p that father >> or a soul that that p that father >> or a soul that that p that father grandfather figure. grandfather figure. grandfather figure. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Who can just say >> Who can just say >> Who can just say >> I'm here for you. Yeah. I love you. I'm >> I'm here for you. Yeah. I love you. I'm >> I'm here for you. Yeah. I love you. I'm I'm on your team. Yeah. And so, so we're I'm on your team. Yeah. And so, so we're I'm on your team. Yeah. And so, so we're going to we're going to wrap up, but I'd going to we're going to wrap up, but I'd going to we're going to wrap up, but I'd love to hear any like final thoughts you love to hear any like final thoughts you love to hear any like final thoughts you have, whether it's a another bit of have, whether it's a another bit of have, whether it's a another bit of research or just like a practical step a research or just like a practical step a research or just like a practical step a parent could take because they're like, parent could take because they're like, parent could take because they're like, man, this is a lot. I understand, okay, man, this is a lot. I understand, okay, man, this is a lot. I understand, okay, the power of a family. I understand the the power of a family. I understand the the power of a family. I understand the the power of this research reminding me the power of this research reminding me the power of this research reminding me that it's my both responsibility and that it's my both responsibility and that it's my both responsibility and privilege and and opportunity because if privilege and and opportunity because if privilege and and opportunity because if I'm the greatest voice in my kids' I'm the greatest voice in my kids' I'm the greatest voice in my kids' lives, I need to take another step in lives, I need to take another step in lives, I need to take another step in that direction. And so what would you that direction. And so what would you that direction. And so what would you say to to parents because you can't do say to to parents because you can't do say to to parents because you can't do you can't do 100 things but you can do you can't do 100 things but you can do you can't do 100 things but you can do one thing one thing one thing >> and I know it can feel so overwhelming >> and I know it can feel so overwhelming >> and I know it can feel so overwhelming and I think one of the um one of a and I think one of the um one of a and I think one of the um one of a really really important piece of passing really really important piece of passing really really important piece of passing on faith right and we talked a lot about on faith right and we talked a lot about on faith right and we talked a lot about conversations and I'll talk to a lot of conversations and I'll talk to a lot of conversations and I'll talk to a lot of parents it's like parents it's like parents it's like >> what is that supposed to sound like?

>> what is that supposed to sound like? >> what is that supposed to sound like? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. >> I I don't even know where to start. Like >> I I don't even know where to start. Like >> I I don't even know where to start. Like that's really hard and I 100% get it. Um that's really hard and I 100% get it. Um that's really hard and I 100% get it. Um and so with One Hope we've created um and so with One Hope we've created um and so with One Hope we've created um just a faith convers it is a one-page just a faith convers it is a one-page just a faith convers it is a one-page guide for parents. And it's just really guide for parents. And it's just really guide for parents. And it's just really simple prompts. It's a framework to get simple prompts. It's a framework to get simple prompts. It's a framework to get it started. Um just how to have faith it started. Um just how to have faith it started. Um just how to have faith conversations. What could it look like? conversations. What could it look like? conversations. What could it look like? What could it sound like? Again, it's What could it sound like? Again, it's What could it sound like? Again, it's not meant to be like, but it's just to not meant to be like, but it's just to not meant to be like, but it's just to hopefully help parents just get their hopefully help parents just get their hopefully help parents just get their brains jump started a little bit on like brains jump started a little bit on like brains jump started a little bit on like what is this faith conversation? What what is this faith conversation? What what is this faith conversation? What could it look like? Um there's a could it look like? Um there's a could it look like? Um there's a practice called the daily examine, but practice called the daily examine, but practice called the daily examine, but we have it broken down into specific age we have it broken down into specific age we have it broken down into specific age group from like early elementary all the group from like early elementary all the group from like early elementary all the way up to high school. just some like way up to high school. just some like way up to high school. just some like daily questions that you can even ask daily questions that you can even ask daily questions that you can even ask your your child in your home like man your your child in your home like man your your child in your home like man what was really good about today like what was really good about today like what was really good about today like where did you see God move like what was where did you see God move like what was where did you see God move like what was really hard like what could we pray like really hard like what could we pray like really hard like what could we pray like what maybe grace do you need for what maybe grace do you need for what maybe grace do you need for tomorrow and just some really great tomorrow and just some really great tomorrow and just some really great questions that I think uh will help questions that I think uh will help questions that I think uh will help parents so that would be one thing is parents so that would be one thing is parents so that would be one thing is just this really simple guide on faith just this really simple guide on faith just this really simple guide on faith conversations conversations conversations >> yeah and I think in that like part of >> yeah and I think in that like part of >> yeah and I think in that like part of what she's pointing to is that this what she's pointing to is that this what she's pointing to is that this takes intentionality um there's a lot of takes intentionality um there's a lot of takes intentionality um there's a lot of research out there that shows that right research out there that shows that right research out there that shows that right now a lot of parents I I don't think now a lot of parents I I don't think now a lot of parents I I don't think this is intentional. It's just that this is intentional. It's just that this is intentional. It's just that they're not sure what to do. So there's they're not sure what to do. So there's they're not sure what to do. So there's not a lot of intentionality in their not a lot of intentionality in their not a lot of intentionality in their parenting toward faith outcomes. Um so parenting toward faith outcomes. Um so parenting toward faith outcomes. Um so one of the best things we can do is one of the best things we can do is one of the best things we can do is build intentionality into our day. Um so build intentionality into our day. Um so build intentionality into our day. Um so even like these daily rhythms, um some even like these daily rhythms, um some even like these daily rhythms, um some things that that we did that were I I things that that we did that were I I things that that we did that were I I think work so well with our girls is think work so well with our girls is think work so well with our girls is that our drive we're actually missing that our drive we're actually missing that our drive we're actually missing this now because our oldest daughter this now because our oldest daughter this now because our oldest daughter drives school

drives school drives school >> which is beautiful. But then we just we >> which is beautiful. But then we just we >> which is beautiful. But then we just we miss that time together miss that time together miss that time together >> because in the car it was conversations >> because in the car it was conversations >> because in the car it was conversations about like okay what are you looking about like okay what are you looking about like okay what are you looking forward to today? What are you not like forward to today? What are you not like forward to today? What are you not like what are you worried about today? What's what are you worried about today? What's what are you worried about today? What's you know what what what are you you know what what what are you you know what what what are you stressing about today? And that led to stressing about today? And that led to stressing about today? And that led to like great moments of us being able to like great moments of us being able to like great moments of us being able to talk about that, pray about those talk about that, pray about those talk about that, pray about those things. things. things. >> Um the drive home from school kind of >> Um the drive home from school kind of >> Um the drive home from school kind of talking through um our girls um talking through um our girls um talking through um our girls um >> tend to do uh what do they call it? a a >> tend to do uh what do they call it? a a >> tend to do uh what do they call it? a a rundown and they'll go block one this rundown and they'll go block one this rundown and they'll go block one this happened, block two, this happened. happened, block two, this happened. happened, block two, this happened. >> We had boys, they said fine, good, >> We had boys, they said fine, good, >> We had boys, they said fine, good, nothing. nothing. nothing. >> Yep. Yep. We've got girls. Yeah. Yeah. >> Yep. Yep. We've got girls. Yeah. Yeah. >> Yep. Yep. We've got girls. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But in that like again that's a Yeah. But in that like again that's a Yeah. But in that like again that's a space where we can step into with them space where we can step into with them space where we can step into with them in that conversation. So those drive in that conversation. So those drive in that conversation. So those drive times um especially we know parents and times um especially we know parents and times um especially we know parents and families are so busy. That's a time families are so busy. That's a time families are so busy. That's a time you're all locked in the car together. you're all locked in the car together. you're all locked in the car together. >> Yep. >> Yep. >> Yep. >> Like make use of that time. >> Like make use of that time. >> Like make use of that time. >> Um the other thing we did was uh we we >> Um the other thing we did was uh we we >> Um the other thing we did was uh we we have made meal time a priority. So, if have made meal time a priority. So, if have made meal time a priority. So, if we are all in the house, we are all in the house, we are all in the house, >> um we are sitting down to dinner >> um we are sitting down to dinner >> um we are sitting down to dinner together at at the table. Uh no together at at the table. Uh no together at at the table. Uh no distractions. Phones are put away.

distractions. Phones are put away. distractions. Phones are put away. There's no there's no screen on. It's There's no there's no screen on. It's There's no there's no screen on. It's just it's just, you know, just it's just, you know, just it's just, you know, >> you can put phones away table. Yeah. >> you can put phones away table. Yeah. >> you can put phones away table. Yeah. Yeah, we do. Yeah, we do. Yeah, we do. >> Wow. >> Wow. >> Wow. >> Our kids will call him out if he takes >> Our kids will call him out if he takes >> Our kids will call him out if he takes We had the same rule at our house and I We had the same rule at our house and I We had the same rule at our house and I got called out probably more than got called out probably more than got called out probably more than anybody else. Put the phones in jail. anybody else. Put the phones in jail. anybody else. Put the phones in jail. >> Yep. Exactly. Exactly. But in that, we >> Yep. Exactly. Exactly. But in that, we >> Yep. Exactly. Exactly. But in that, we built routines. I mean, just like silly built routines. I mean, just like silly built routines. I mean, just like silly things like like high low, you know, things like like high low, you know, things like like high low, you know, what was your high of the day? What was what was your high of the day? What was what was your high of the day? What was your low of the day? Sometimes we'd your low of the day? Sometimes we'd your low of the day? Sometimes we'd throw in hy low buffalo. What was throw in hy low buffalo. What was throw in hy low buffalo. What was buffalo is the weird thing. What weird buffalo is the weird thing. What weird buffalo is the weird thing. What weird thing happened? thing happened? thing happened? >> Buffalo. >> Buffalo. >> Buffalo. >> Um what other ones have we done? >> Um what other ones have we done? >> Um what other ones have we done? >> Uh we've done thankful ones before. >> Uh we've done thankful ones before. >> Uh we've done thankful ones before. >> Yeah. What are you thank What were you >> Yeah. What are you thank What were you >> Yeah. What are you thank What were you most thankful for today? How did you see most thankful for today? How did you see most thankful for today? How did you see God today? God today? God today? >> Just like those kind of questions. >> Just like those kind of questions. >> Just like those kind of questions. >> And what it did is it led to now were >> And what it did is it led to now were >> And what it did is it led to now were were they always the deepest responses were they always the deepest responses were they always the deepest responses from them or from us? No. Not from them or from us? No. Not from them or from us? No. Not necessarily. necessarily. necessarily. >> Did I always feel like doing that? No. >> Did I always feel like doing that? No. >> Did I always feel like doing that? No. Like there's some days where I'm like I Like there's some days where I'm like I Like there's some days where I'm like I don't want to talk about my day. It was don't want to talk about my day. It was don't want to talk about my day. It was a bad day, right? You know, but what it a bad day, right? You know, but what it a bad day, right? You know, but what it taught them is first of all, it taught taught them is first of all, it taught taught them is first of all, it taught them a rhythm of like thinking about them a rhythm of like thinking about them a rhythm of like thinking about processing bringing those things to the processing bringing those things to the processing bringing those things to the Lord in prayer together.

Lord in prayer together. Lord in prayer together. >> Um it gave them language around some of >> Um it gave them language around some of >> Um it gave them language around some of the feelings that they were feeling. the feelings that they were feeling. the feelings that they were feeling. >> And it also got let them see into mom >> And it also got let them see into mom >> And it also got let them see into mom and dad's life that mom and dad's life and dad's life that mom and dad's life and dad's life that mom and dad's life isn't always perfect either. and that isn't always perfect either. and that isn't always perfect either. and that we're figuring things out and the and we're figuring things out and the and we're figuring things out and the and the way we're figuring things out and the way we're figuring things out and the way we're figuring things out and the way we're taking those things to, the way we're taking those things to, the way we're taking those things to, >> you know, to the Lord. >> you know, to the Lord. >> you know, to the Lord. >> Um, so I just like those types of >> Um, so I just like those types of >> Um, so I just like those types of intentionality pieces because if you intentionality pieces because if you intentionality pieces because if you look at warmth, wonder, walk, look at warmth, wonder, walk, look at warmth, wonder, walk, >> it's not asking you to like add >> it's not asking you to like add >> it's not asking you to like add something new to your schedule. something new to your schedule. something new to your schedule. >> It's build a warm environment, be open >> It's build a warm environment, be open >> It's build a warm environment, be open to conversations and doubts and and to to conversations and doubts and and to to conversations and doubts and and to going deeper in those going deeper in those going deeper in those >> and then model that you are growing in >> and then model that you are growing in >> and then model that you are growing in your faith. So grow in your faith and your faith. So grow in your faith and your faith. So grow in your faith and model that, right? So, it's not really model that, right? So, it's not really model that, right? So, it's not really asking anything more of you. Um, and asking anything more of you. Um, and asking anything more of you. Um, and these spaces are just a way of these spaces are just a way of these spaces are just a way of intentionally setting up like that we intentionally setting up like that we intentionally setting up like that we can enter into those spaces together. can enter into those spaces together. can enter into those spaces together. It's making those routines. Also, before It's making those routines. Also, before It's making those routines. Also, before bedtime was was, you know, like a bedtime was was, you know, like a bedtime was was, you know, like a conversation point for us. Uh, we still conversation point for us. Uh, we still conversation point for us. Uh, we still with our girls, I don't know if they'll with our girls, I don't know if they'll with our girls, I don't know if they'll appreciate us saying this, we still pray appreciate us saying this, we still pray appreciate us saying this, we still pray with them every night before bed.

with them every night before bed. with them every night before bed. >> That's great. >> That's great. >> That's great. >> Um, and in that there'll be >> Um, and in that there'll be >> Um, and in that there'll be conversations. conversations. conversations. >> They're older and they want to stay up >> They're older and they want to stay up >> They're older and they want to stay up later. later. later. >> That is true. >> That is true. >> That is true. So we we spent the first decade and a So we we spent the first decade and a So we we spent the first decade and a half tucking our kids into bed and then half tucking our kids into bed and then half tucking our kids into bed and then they tucked us into bed. That's how it they tucked us into bed. That's how it they tucked us into bed. That's how it works. Yep. That's right. works. Yep. That's right. works. Yep. That's right. >> Yeah. I I think when I think about the >> Yeah. I I think when I think about the >> Yeah. I I think when I think about the the dinner table, at least for the our the dinner table, at least for the our the dinner table, at least for the our family, it was like the most powerful family, it was like the most powerful family, it was like the most powerful place of formation of any spaces. I place of formation of any spaces. I place of formation of any spaces. I mean, we did the drive the car, we did mean, we did the drive the car, we did mean, we did the drive the car, we did the night tuck in, but for us, the table the night tuck in, but for us, the table the night tuck in, but for us, the table was the place of a formation, the highs, was the place of a formation, the highs, was the place of a formation, the highs, the lows. And I think that's where you the lows. And I think that's where you the lows. And I think that's where you you those deeper things of security. you those deeper things of security. you those deeper things of security. You're always safe here. You'll always You're always safe here. You'll always You're always safe here. You'll always be fed here. be fed here. be fed here. >> Um your identity. this is what it means >> Um your identity. this is what it means >> Um your identity. this is what it means to be a Souer. We talk about the highs to be a Souer. We talk about the highs to be a Souer. We talk about the highs and lows. Um where God's working, and lows. Um where God's working, and lows. Um where God's working, >> you know, we talk about belonging. >> you know, we talk about belonging. >> you know, we talk about belonging. You'll always belong at this table. Even You'll always belong at this table. Even You'll always belong at this table. Even when you move away, go to college, you when you move away, go to college, you when you move away, go to college, you belong at this table. belong at this table. belong at this table. >> And that sense of purpose and even even >> And that sense of purpose and even even >> And that sense of purpose and even even inviting their friends to the table and inviting their friends to the table and inviting their friends to the table and saying, "Hey, this the Solder family is saying, "Hey, this the Solder family is saying, "Hey, this the Solder family is not just about us. We're about inviting not just about us. We're about inviting not just about us. We're about inviting other people into the space." other people into the space." other people into the space." >> And I just heard this week a really >> And I just heard this week a really >> And I just heard this week a really great question to ask around the table great question to ask around the table great question to ask around the table because the hardest thing for parents is because the hardest thing for parents is because the hardest thing for parents is asking good questions. One of the asking good questions. One of the asking good questions. One of the questions that someone said is highs, questions that someone said is highs, questions that someone said is highs, lows, where's God working? And the lows, where's God working? And the lows, where's God working? And the fourth question was, "What mistake did I fourth question was, "What mistake did I fourth question was, "What mistake did I make today?"

make today?" make today?" >> And I thought, "What what a great way to >> And I thought, "What what a great way to >> And I thought, "What what a great way to like be vulnerable and say, I'm human like be vulnerable and say, I'm human like be vulnerable and say, I'm human and I need grace just like you need and I need grace just like you need and I need grace just like you need grace." grace." grace." >> Um, so yeah, I think I think >> Um, so yeah, I think I think >> Um, so yeah, I think I think >> just starting at the at the table and >> just starting at the at the table and >> just starting at the at the table and being intentional with those 20 minutes being intentional with those 20 minutes being intentional with those 20 minutes of eating together is is a powerful of eating together is is a powerful of eating together is is a powerful start. start. start. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> But we'll provide some of those book >> But we'll provide some of those book >> But we'll provide some of those book resources, some of those questions for resources, some of those questions for resources, some of those questions for our listeners. Guys, thank you so much our listeners. Guys, thank you so much our listeners. Guys, thank you so much for spending the last hour with us and for spending the last hour with us and for spending the last hour with us and we are grateful for your ministry at One we are grateful for your ministry at One we are grateful for your ministry at One Hope and at our church and uh looking Hope and at our church and uh looking Hope and at our church and uh looking forward to ongoing conversations. forward to ongoing conversations. forward to ongoing conversations. >> Yeah, thanks for having us. >> Yeah, thanks for having us. >> Yeah, thanks for having us. >> Thanks for tuning in for our >> Thanks for tuning in for our >> Thanks for tuning in for our conversation on family. And don't conversation on family. And don't conversation on family. And don't forget, we have great resources forget, we have great resources forget, we have great resources available for you on this topic and more available for you on this topic and more available for you on this topic and more in the show notes, as well as a link to in the show notes, as well as a link to in the show notes, as well as a link to our weekend teaching all about the our weekend teaching all about the our weekend teaching all about the family. And this isn't the end of our family. And this isn't the end of our family. And this isn't the end of our deep dive conversations. We have more deep dive conversations. We have more deep dive conversations. We have more coming up on different relationships in coming up on different relationships in coming up on different relationships in our lives. So, we'll see you there.